TaxAlmanac - User contributions [en]

User:DZCPA

2013-05-09T05:00:25Z

DZCPA:

{{Start Boxes}}
{{CPA}}
{{GROW}}
{{Gold}}
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''' CPA since 1984 with a large tax practice in Southern California. Using Lacerte tax software for over 25 years. Currently prepare 1,000 Individual, 120 S Corp, 25 C Corp, 30 Partnership, 20 Fiduciary.

[[Image:IMG 7610 copy.jpg|500px]]
'''MONTE CARLO - Summer 2006 '''
http://www.taxalmanac.org/images/1/15/DZZZ.JPG
July 10, 2009
[[Category:California Residents]]
[[Category:People with Photos]]

If you'd like to leave me a message, just select the discussion tab at the top of this page.

Discussion:Can IRS Examine S-Corp Items w/o a Formal Audit?

2011-10-21T16:13:17Z

DZCPA:

{{Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Viking|Date=21 October 2011|Text=Taxpayer's individual returns (2008-2009) are in Audit, and they show a carry-forward NOL from a dissolved S-Corp. IRS now wants to examine items on the S-Corp's returns (e.g. 2005 & 2006 which were filed timely) without a formal audit of the S-Corp. They are doing this, they explain, to confirm the carry-forward NOL.

I would have assumed that the S-Corp returns must be Audited (which would be too late now) in order to request substantiation of items (e.g. expenses) on the S-Corp returns..??

Any regulations that show that IRS have the right to do what they ask? }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Podolin|Date=21 October 2011|Text=Why is it too late to examine the S corp? It is too ate to assess a tax but not to change the loss claimed.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Hammock|Date=21 October 2011|Text=Recommend researching taxpayer rights. I believe they may need to formally open up an audit, unless it is just basis.
The 1998 legislation is the starting point. I don't have another info at this time.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Viking|Date=21 October 2011|Text=Podolin,
Since S-Corps are pass-through entities the Corp can never be taxed. If the Corp had a loss, it would flow to the taxpayer, and show on his individual return for 2005. I would have thought that IRS had three years (from the later of the due date or date of filing) to examine items on the return (except for basis as Hammock pointed out). Do you have any reference to show that they can examine the return at any time to change a claimed loss?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DaveFogel|Date=21 October 2011|Text=If the taxpayer claims an NOL on an individual return that results from a loss sustained by an S corporation, then the IRS has every right to make the taxpayer prove that the S corporation sustained the NOL. And if the NOL is a carryforward of NOLs sustained by the S corporation in prior years, then the IRS has the right to examine those prior years' returns to make the taxpayer prove the existence of the NOLs in prior years.

I have posted the following research in many other discussions on this board.

In determining whether a taxpayer is entitled to a net operating loss (NOL) deduction resulting from an NOL carried forward from an earlier year, the taxpayer is required to prove that an NOL was sustained in the previous tax year and that the loss, when carried back and then carried forward, would not have been absorbed in the intervening years. ''Davis v. Commissioner'', 674 F.2d 553 (6th Cir. 1982), affg. T.C. Memo. 1980-581; ''Jones v. Commissioner'', 25 T.C. 1100 (1956), revd. and remanded on another issue, 259 F.2d 300 (5th Cir. 1958); ''Rubin v. Commissioner'', 26 T.C. 1076, 1083 (1956); ''Egly v. Commissioner'', T.C. Memo. 1988-223; ''Naegle v. Commissioner'', T.C. Memo. 1965-212, affd. per curiam 378 F.2d 397 (9th Cir. 1967). A taxpayer may not merely rely upon the tax return filed with the IRS to prove the NOL sustained in the previous year because the return is a statement of the taxpayer's claim and does not establish the existence of an NOL. ''Wilkinson v. Commissioner'', 71 T.C. 633, 639 (1979). The same rules apply to an NOL carryover, a capital loss carryover, a tax credit carryover, or a passive loss carryover. See, e.g., ''Knowles v. Commissioner'', T.C. Memo. 2011-23 (capital loss carryover).}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Viking|Date=21 October 2011|Text=DaveFogel,
Thanks for the detailed references!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fsteincpa|Date=21 October 2011|Text=Dave, always appreciative of your input. Never had this issue before and I hope I never do, but a question arises.

Does the mere existence of these loss carry forwards leave the S-Corps vulnerable to audit and adjustment?

I haven't read or researched and am only asking because I have read this post and that's the thought that immediately came to mind.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=21 October 2011|Text=Generally can not adjust more than loss amount. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fsteincpa|Date=21 October 2011|Text=DZ, what does that mean? Can they do a complete audit? Can it be adjusted to a point where the client could owe tax on a 2001 return? }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Podolin|Date=21 October 2011|Text=Absent fraud or a >25% gross income omission at the level of the taxpaying entity/person, there can be no tax due on a 2001 return (filed in 2002). But they can examine and adjust anything in a closed return year, whether of the taxpayer or an entity that flows thru to the taxpayer, that affects the open years of the taxpaying entity/person. Basis of depreciable assets comes to mind as an example.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=21 October 2011|Text=They can adjust the S corp return so the NOLis worth ZERO. Your taxpayer may then owe tax on their return. }}

Discussion:Can IRS Examine S-Corp Items w/o a Formal Audit?

2011-10-21T15:54:29Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Need phone number

2011-10-19T19:32:37Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}

{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Link1time|Date=17 February 2006|Text=Does anyone have the number for the Practioner's Hotline. I have a client that filed a form 5329 in April, 2005 asking for abatement of penalities and never heard a word. Called 800 829-1040 and the person I talked to said my client should have received some kind of notice within 30 days. He suggested I re-file so we did 12/05 and still haven't heard a word. Think its time to head in another direction.

If anyone had a number or suggestions, would greatly appreciate it.
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CTurner555|Date=18 February 2006|Text=Practitioner Priority Service ®

Practitioner Priority Service—your first point of contact

Practitioner Priority Service—your first point of contact for account-related issues.
Our Practitioner Priority Service is a professional support line (1.866.860.4259) staffed by IRS customer service representatives specially trained to handle practitioners’ accounts questions.

Practitioner Priority Service is a toll-free, accounts-related service for all tax practitioners, nationwide. It is the practitioners’ first point of contact for assistance regarding taxpayers’ account-related issues. The hours of service are weekdays, 7:30 a.m. until 6:30 p.m. local time (with the exception of Alaska and Hawaii, which are Pacific Time).

Questions regarding client's individual tax accounts (IMF) are handled by one of three campus sites: Brookhaven, NY; Memphis, TN; and Philadelphia, PA. Questions regarding client's business accounts (BMF) are handled by two campus sites: Cincinnati, OH and Ogden, UT. Calls are routed based on an evaluation of the lowest expected wait time. Issues outside the scope of the employees’ authority are transferred or referred to the appropriate IRS functions.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Taxjn|Date=18 February 2006|Text=Practitioner Contacts

Title
Telephone Number
Hours of Operation

Practitioner Priority Service
866-860-4259
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time.

IRS Tax Help Line for Individuals
800-829-1040
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., Local Time.

Business and Specialty Tax Line
800-829-4933
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time.

e-Help (Practitioners Only)
866-255-0654
7:30 - 6:00 p.m. ET & 7:30 - 5:00 p.m. MT

Refund Hotline
800-829-1954
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time. Automated Service available after business hours.

Forms and Publications
800-829-3676
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time.

National Taxpayer Advocate’s Help Line
877-777-4778
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time.

Centralized Lien Payoff
800-913-6050
M-F, 8:00am – 11:00pm ET

Centralized Bankruptcy
800-913-9358
M-F 7am – 10pm ET

Telephone Device for the Deaf (TDD)
800-829-4059
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time.

Electronic Federal Tax Payment System
800-555-4477
24 hour operation; POC is available M-F 8:00am - 4:30pm

Government Entities (TEGE) Help Line
877-829-5500
M-F 8:30 a.m. - 4:30 p.m. ET

Extension to File
800-829-4477
N/A

Form 706 and 709 Help Line
866-699-4083
M-F, 7:00 a.m. - 7:00 p.m. local time

Automated Collection System (Business)
800-829-3903
M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m. local time.

Automated Collection System (Individual)
800-829-7650
M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m. local time.

Criminal Investigation Informant Hotline
800-829-0433
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time.

Employer Identification Number (EIN)
800-829-4933
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time.

Excise Tax and Form 2290 Help Line
866-699-4096
Mon - Fri 8:00 am - 6:00 pm EST

Information Return Reporting
866-455-7438
M-F, 8:30am - 4:30pm (EST)

Terrorist Act or Combat Zone Special Hotline
866-562-5227
EFFECTIVE 1/9/2006, M-F, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m., local time.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tdoyle|Date=18 February 2006|Text=The information in the post above is very useful information that could be used by many people. It deserves to be an article on TaxAlmanac, not just included in a discussion that will soon scroll off the front topic page listing. Could someone convert this to an article?

Here's how:

# Copy the information above into your buffer (highlight with your mouse, then select Copy from your browser's Edit pulldown menu)
# Type the name of the article in the '''search''' box on the left of the screen - an appropriate title here might be "Practitioner Contacts" - then hit enter or press the '''Go''' button.
# A search results page will be displayed. Select the '''Create a new article with the title Practitioner Contacts''' link.
# Paste the contents into that screen (click in the edit box, then select Edit-Paste from the pulldown menu)
# Select '''Save Page'''.

Once added as an article to the site, it will be incorporated into the appropriate menus so that others can easily find it.

Is anyone up for helping out here?

Thank you!

- [[User:Tdoyle|Tim Doyle, TaxAlmanac Moderator]] 10:56, 18 February 2006 (CST)}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tdoyle|Date=18 February 2006|Text=Special thanks to [[User:Aisha|Aisha]] for taking the initiative to create the new article [[Practitioner Contacts]]! Great job, Aisha!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Roaringcpa|Date=18 October 2011|Text=I am calling the PPS line and I have been on hold for an HOUR!! Any suggestions on what hours are best to call? And this is one of those non-billable calls....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Lisaw|Date=19 October 2011|Text=I feel your pain! No idea. I have nothing but bad luck calling. Usually 45 to 1 hour.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=19 October 2011|Text=Call back and hit "8" spanish line. They are bilingua. A little secret when calling IRS!!!! BIG TIME SAVER. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Lisaw|Date=19 October 2011|Text=DZCPA - That my be the best secret IRS tip I have ever heard! Brilliant! I will definitely be giving that a try.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=19 October 2011|Text=Mucho Gracias!}}

Discussion:Making Your Biz More Efficient ?

2011-10-19T16:21:42Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=26 September 2011|Text=What have you done this year to make your biz more efficient? or reduce costs? or increase costs that MORE than paid for themselves? Or outsourced/delegated something that gave YOU more time off? What's the single, best thing (or 2) that made your biz a little less dependent on you being there everyday, touching every piece of paper (other than signing off) that you've EVER done, even if it was a decade ago? }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CathysTaxes|Date=27 September 2011|Text=Well to reduce costs and be more efficient, I went with a different tax prep software. I'm too small with rates too low to keep Lacerte.

Another thing I did to keep costs down was to scan my clients' documents in instead of making copies. I also don't keep a paper copy of the returns, just a PDF version (with redundant backups).}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wkstaxprep|Date=18 October 2011|Text=I tried to hand pick the 20-30% of clients who I feel need extra guidance each year and seem to give me their info in piece meal and disorderly fashion. For those clients, since mid October to mid December is slow, I prepare personal proforma worksheets for these clients to help them provide the info. for example

here were your expenses from last year, please provide amounts for this year. prior year amounts are in brackets (please just give the amount, keep your receipts in a safe place in case they are needed down the road or i request verification of any items)

cell phone - business use ($300)
local business travel ($200)
job hunting expenses ($500) }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Zeljko1va|Date=19 October 2011|Text=Cathy- which software did you chose as replacement to Lacerte? I have been using Drake but I am getting very frustrated with issues on local tax returns. I am in OH and local taxes are crazy around here.
Jake}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=PirateCPA|Date=19 October 2011|Text=Wkstaxprep, what software do you use? I thought almost all commercial use software came with organizers that will use data from the prior year.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Gjkycpa|Date=19 October 2011|Text=Switched from Lacerte to Drake. This will be my 3rd year of the change. Lacerte is much better but the price difference is huge. Not 100% satisfied with the Drake, but managing OK. Will try to continue the move to paperless this coming tax season. Still not entirely comfortable with it. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tim g|Date=19 October 2011|Text=This year we are switching to an online scheduling program so that clients can make their own appointments over the internet. The program will also send an email or text message as a reminder that they have an appointment with us. Hopefully that will reduce the amount of forgotten or late arrivals for appointments. The program is through Appointments Plus. We are also setting up a web portal so clients can send documents and we can return them securely.

we switched from Pro Series to Drake 7 years ago. 99% of the time Drake does everything we need. We are in PA. PA local returns can be a mess, but that has been true with every software program I have ever tried. OH is the only one that is worse than PA.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=19 October 2011|Text=Went "less paper" by scanning documents and saving tax files to as PDF files into computer. Also using GOTOMYPC.COM to do work from home. Saves driving to work every day. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Gjkycpa|Date=19 October 2011|Text=DZCPA, 2 questions

1 What do you use for backup, as you go paperless?

2 Are you happy with the gotomypc.com platform, and how much does it cost? }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=19 October 2011|Text=Back up, dual harddrive and off site backups that are done automatically daily. Gotomypc costs about $12 a month per computer. }}

Discussion:Need phone number

2011-10-19T15:54:04Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Non payment of Tax Prep

2011-10-19T15:47:38Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Ztom|Date=9 September 2011|Text=Is there a form to send IRS regarding non payment of fees? I understand you can send IRS a statement of form stating you are a non paid preparer for non payment of fees.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=NoVATaxes|Date=9 September 2011|Text=Previous discussions on the same topic seems to indicate it's more of a scare tactic than something you can actually do. My office avoids this dilemma by never e-filing or releasing a return to the client without full payment ahead of time. In cases where the fee is to be withheld from the refund, they're turned over to collection if the refund doesn't materialize.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CrowJD|Date=9 September 2011|Text=It's getting harder to collect in the present environment. Find a "heavy" in the neighborhood who will rough them up but not break any bones. It's hard to do, but I tell my clients up front I come before their kids. They can have another kid in 9 months, but they need me right now.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Bbowers|Date=9 September 2011|Text=I used the "threat" a couple of time 4-5 years ago. One perosn didn't pay so I sent a letter to the IRS & got a response back that they would not make that change. Since then I've tried to hold to the pay before we file plan like NoVATaxes uses. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=9 September 2011|Text=Don't do any of that sillyness. Life's too short. Send late notice monthly for 12 months. Cost appx $7. Tell 'em they cannot deduct the tax prep fee this year if not paid by 12/31/11. This actually works! If continue unpaid, its the Price of experience in the school of hard knocks. Move to the popular collection-prior-to-e-filing strategy if you feel that need. My transmittal letter says that, but I don't enforce it. My collection problems are near zero. I have 5 or 10 that predictably pay me right before they need more work done the next year. They get a PITA surcharge. This is more of a pride issue for the preparer. NOT a money issue. Really, how much $$$ are we talking about. What % of total revenue? 1%? 0.1%?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Lizzit|Date=10 September 2011|Text=Debt collectors work on a percentage basis. Or just follow their proceedures yourself. You may lose the client, but do you really need this one?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Mdubincpa|Date=10 September 2011|Text=I have used the following letter as a method of confronting the deadbeats with a potentail IRS issue unless they pay timely in full.

I would send them a cover letter suggesting that if I don't receive payment in full within ten days from the date of my letter I will have no other option but to forward this attached letter to the IRS.

Date
Taxpayers Name
Address

RE: Fee for preparation of your 2000 U. S.
Individual Federal Tax Return - $
Taxpayer SSN Spouse SSN

Dear

Pursuant to Section 10.34 of United States Treasury Department Circular Number 230, Title 31, Code of Federal Regulations, I prepared the above referenced Federal tax return in anticipation of payment for my services, and accordingly, signed the return as the PAID PREPARER.

As of this date, I have neither received payment from you nor have I received communication, written or oral, indicating your intent to pay the preparation fee.

I, therefore, will on (some date in reasonable future) notify the Internal Revenue Service of the inaccuracy in the reporting of PAID PREPARER information on the above referenced tax return. Your Attention to this very important matter is hereby requested and your prompt remittance of the ($ amt) is anticipated to be forthcoming.

Sincerely,

CC: U. S. Department of the Treasury,
Internal Revenue Service, Examination Division
DATE TO SEND

It has actually worked for me on more than one occasion.

Best of luck

Mike Dubin CPA }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=LJK CPA|Date=10 September 2011|Text=If they are a long time client I will hold a check. I have only gotten burned once doing this. Getting the check later is more difficult. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=10 September 2011|Text=Mdubin: a colleague of mine did that exact same thing, the client retaliated by filing complaint with Texas State Board of Public Accountancy. Board suspended his license for 90 days, which, since he issued appx 90 compilation reports per month, effectively put him out of biz. He surrendered his CPA certificate and is now an EA. This happened about 10-12 yrs ago. FOLKS! we have MUCH more to lose than a deadbeat client or two. Do NOT play chicken with them. Of course they are in the wrong. So what? Move on. Life is too short even without this kind of risk.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wkstaxprep|Date=18 October 2011|Text=Fletch,

I believe what you wrote, but is it possible we are missing somethign here? Just because he sent a letter he got his license suspended? Something doesn't seem right. Also, 90 compilation reports per month? Seems a bit unrealistic. I'm just saying....

I do agree with what you wrote, that it's best to just mov eon and let it go. It's like anything else in life, always a few bad seeds in the bunch.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Szptax|Date=18 October 2011|Text=If you have a recurring deadbeat - don't release the return without payment and if mailing is requested, send COD through the post office. I have a few that have drug their feet in years past. They get an email/text/call and when I arrange pick-up or delivery they know the amount is due. If we cannot meet in person (to review etc) and I don't trust their history, I mail it COD. If I do trust them and they send the 8879s back without payment, I request an updated one with the appropriate signature date when they pay.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=18 October 2011|Text=90 compilations reports each month was his writeup biz. Yes, it happened. I left out no salient details. It was horrible.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wkstaxprep|Date=18 October 2011|Text=ok Fletch thanks :)

also, the more i think about it i can see the IRS getting a bit annoyed at receiving such a letter.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=LJACPA|Date=19 October 2011|Text=I am also very humbled that I do not deal with this very often, however I have a couple of clients who are notorious for conveniently 'forgetting' to include the payment with the 8879. I added a paragraph in all my engagement letters that states that I cannot e-file with an open invoice and they still ignore it. As I end up telling any client who does this they are putting me between that 'rock and a hard place' by giving me the 8879 thus putting the requirement on me to not stockpile and to e-file within 3 days and e-filing as paid preparer when I'm not (adding that this might be construed as a fraudulently filed return; a bit of an exaggeration?). Usually works but sometimes I still have to pursue. Just downright disrespectful as far as I'm concerned.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=19 October 2011|Text=The non paid preparer letter works great and is not breaking any rules per AICPA or CA Society of CPA. Just because the IRS will perhaps do nothing does not mean one should not disclose to them the facts regarding payments. }}

Discussion:Making Your Biz More Efficient ?

2011-10-19T15:31:08Z

DZCPA:

User talk:DZCPA

2011-10-12T23:37:48Z

DZCPA: Blanked the page

User:DZCPA

2011-10-12T23:37:21Z

DZCPA:

{{Start Boxes}}
{{CPA}}
{{GROW}}
{{Gold}}
{{End Boxes}}{{Award|Forum}}

''' CPA since 1984 with a large tax practice in Southern California. Using Lacerte tax software for over 22 years. Currently prepare 1,300 Individual, 120 S Corp, 25 C Corp, 30 Partnership, 20 Fiduciary.

[[Image:IMG 7610 copy.jpg|500px]]
'''MONTE CARLO - Summer 2006 '''
http://www.taxalmanac.org/images/1/15/DZZZ.JPG
July 10, 2009
[[Category:California Residents]]
[[Category:People with Photos]]

If you'd like to leave me a message, just select the discussion tab at the top of this page.

File:DZZZ.JPG

2011-10-12T23:35:26Z

DZCPA:

File:Untitled.JPG

2011-10-12T23:32:22Z

DZCPA: uploaded a new version of "File:Untitled.JPG"

Discussion:Meeting with a field auditor

2011-10-10T02:50:25Z

DZCPA:

{{General Chat}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=LJACPA|Date=10 October 2011|Text=I knew this would eventually happen and certainly expected an amended return I prepared was going to be the one that would be audited. It's been years since I was involved in an audit, which wasn't fun at all and I was with a firm at the time where I had some help and direction from the senior partner. This time I'm completely on my own. I'd love to have someone else do this but there were so many complications with the amended return I don't think it would be worthwhile to bring someone else in, catch them up and let them do the audit. Anyway, I got a call the other day to set up a meeting, which the agent seemed to think would be a simple confirm some items, etc and be done with it; I sure hope so. However, he requested either the taxpayer or the spouse be present for the interview portion and I've always understood that having the client present was not advisable. I don't think that I could say no to this and wonder if this is common and whether I should be concerned to have him or her there.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Zokan|Date=10 October 2011|Text=Internal Revenue Code section 7521(c)

An officer or employee of the Internal Revenue Service may not require a taxpayer accompany the representative in the absence of an administrative summons issued to the taxpayer.....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tax Writer|Date=10 October 2011|Text=They always want the taxpayer to be present. We never, ever, ever allow it. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=10 October 2011|Text=LJACPA, 7 Years without an audit. Not bad!. Just say NO to allowing client to show.}}

Discussion:Buying Clients - Privacy Issues

2011-10-06T00:58:30Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Jpw28|Date=30 September 2011|Text=I am looking to buy a retiring practitioner's clients and was wondering how to handle the privacy side of the purchase. I will want to obtain the previous year's tax return and any other information in the client file from the retiring preparer before meeting with the client and I would think there would be some privacy issues if this was just handed over without client consent? How is this type of transition typically handled. The retiring preparer will be writing a letter introducing me, etc but much assistance beyond that in terms of transition is not available (ie; joint meeting, etc)}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=30 September 2011|Text=Generally, you sign a non-disclosure agreement stating that you will hold the information in confidence. Check out the IRS' info on 7216 and you'll see that it is OK for the selling practitioner to disclose client's tax info to the buyer.

I wouldn't buy a practice without getting the client files.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=6 October 2011|Text=The letter of introduction should ALSO include that all files will be given to you unless the tax payer disagrees.}}

Discussion:Daughter going to be a CPA!

2011-10-06T00:47:52Z

DZCPA:

{{Basic Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=5 October 2011|Text=http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=786286313960&set=a.558150450060.2099641.19911642&type=1&ref=nf}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=5 October 2011|Text=My daughter Jacqueline took the Becker Review course shortly after graduating California State University - Fullerton. She had a 3.5 GPA with a double major in Accounting and Finance. Passed the complete exam at one time. She has been working for me the last 5 years. Not bad for a 23 year old! Very Proud Dad!!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=FLAcct|Date=5 October 2011|Text=Congratulations to both you and your daughter!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Laketahoecpa|Date=6 October 2011|Text=That's great! Congratulations. You should be very proud.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Uncle Sam|Date=6 October 2011|Text=Will she be a poster here?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=6 October 2011|Text=I gave her the link today. I will encourage her to join. Thanks for all the best wishes.}}

Discussion:Daughter going to be a CPA!

2011-10-05T23:49:41Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Daughter going to be a CPA!

2011-10-05T23:43:46Z

DZCPA: New Discussion

Discussion:Lacerte service requests useless

2011-10-05T22:59:26Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=RobAZCPA|Date=5 October 2011|Text=Does it take anyone else a week or more to use the new Lacerte communications? For those of you who are lucky and haven't had to use the communications manager for a while, the process has changed. You still initiate an email through Tools --> Communications --> Lacerte E-mail, but the response comes directly to your inbox. Or doesn't. The response is also logged at your account at lacerte.intuit.com, where the status shows open or closed.

I've had the privilege of looking for a response every day for a week. Other responses have taken a week as well. Our firm is still waiting for a response for some returns that failed e-file XML schema validation for federal and California partnership returns, which are well past due even accounting for the additional time granted when the return was first rejected.

Obviously, we should have mailed the returns by now without waiting, but does anyone have a suggestion on how to get decent customer service from Lacerte? We pay them a lot of money.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=LJK CPA|Date=5 October 2011|Text=I have always had good experiences using Lacerte communications. I found that this method was superior to phone calls because they seemed to route it to the person who could answer the question. The longest I've waited is three days for a response, which is not great, but never a week. Did you call them? Perhaps ask to talk to a supervisor and let them know what happened? Keep us posted, please. Considering the fees they charge, customers should expect premium customer service!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=5 October 2011|Text=I always call and get the answer by phone in a few minutes.}}

Discussion:Your First Year In Business - Share your Experience

2011-04-25T02:20:41Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=15 February 2011|Text=So as I sit here with no clients to speak of I am wondering what is the proper expectation for me to have as far as client growth in the first year. I have a few returns completed for family members (some paid, some free i.e. parents and mother-in-law) that I have been doing for years. I actually do have one "new" client which is still a family member who I hadn't prepared taxes for in the past. I also have a few more family members who will come in over the next month or so, but I have yet to get that first non-related client.

In terms of referrals I have asked for them and I do offer referral fees, but it seems that at this point the family members I have prepared returns for are not the referring kind. While I somewhat expected this to be the case as far as referrals it still doesn't help. As I read some of the discussions it seems that the more established professionals are doing fairly well. Some of you have mentioned that business is somewhat flat compared to last year at this point, others have already added up to 25 new clients. I think if I did 25 all this first season I would be pretty happy with that at this point.

So my question is what was your first year like. How did you land that first real client and what would you recommend for those of us starting out this year. Please indicate whether you started out full-time or part-time. I am a part-timer this year working out of a home office so I would be interested in folks that started out the same, but please whatever your situation please everyone share your experience. If this is your first year please share your experience right now as well. What is working for you and what has not worked out as well as you had expected. '''All posters please answer this question if you are so inclined: If you were building your practice and you could only use two marketing methods (one for individuals and one for small biz clients) what would they be?'''

As for me I know that my marketing efforts leave much to be desired but I did expect to at least get some phone calls or actual communication. To date I have received decent traffic to my website but no real inquiries. Sadly I have actually lost 3 family members to HR Block. 2 of them (mother and daughter) I really never had, 1 called and was waiting for docs to arrive, once they did they decided they needed their cash fast so they are going to Block. In both cases I let them know what was going on at Block this year right up front and it didn't seem to take hold in their minds.

This has caused me to shift my focus more towards small business, but I think I may be getting a late start, I'm not sure. I was invited to a meeting at my local Chamber of Commerce by my web designer(who will be my first small biz client) tomorrow morning. The meeting is with the Chamber Ambassadors, which is a team of chamber members who work specifically with new and prospective chamber members so I am pretty excited about the opportunity. Hopefully it pays some dividends this tax season, but if not it is a good building block.

I certainly don't mean to be a downer to anybody, just looking for a little direction. Hopefully your replies will help a few of us out.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 February 2011|Text=My first year (22 years ago) was slow. I was full-time. I rented space in an old 1870 farmhouse on a busy road near my home and put out one of those electric signs (with the flashing arrow). I bought an extension cord and floodlights and set them up shining on the building so that it would attract people driving home from work in the evening. I printed flyers with coupons and put them underneath people's winshield wipers at the nearby K-Mart parking lot. I went around and taped the flyers on people's mailboxes (you can't put them in the mailboxes). I went out and handed out business cards to every business within a 10 mile radius.

I didn't wait around for the phone to ring, that's for sure. And I returned phone messages the same day (returning to the office at least two times while out doing my marketing). I left a note on the front door saying what time I'd be back just in case a walk-in came by.

I plowed everything I made that year back into the business. I borrowed from my sister and cashed in a 401(k) for living expenses. I would not have survived to the following tax season if I hadn't had those resources. I honestly considered getting a job during the Summer to pay bills, but decided that would be admitting that I wasn't serious about my business, so I knuckled down and went out and called on those same businesses again and again every three months. Someone, at some time, has a tax problem, and when opportunity meets preparedness, luck happens. I was lucky that I was prepared, and I was lucky that I wasn't lazy. I couldn't afford to be shy. Shyness is for employees. Boldness is for business owners.

If it was raining and too nasty to go out to drum up business, I read IRS publications and tax books like J.K. Lasser. Like the lumberjack sharpening his axe during his break, you have to constantly hone your skills so that when you do work, you are sharp and ready.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 February 2011|Text=Oh yeah, I should probably add that I made mistakes on many of those first (second and third) year returns also. I didn't know nearly enough. But I amended them for free and depending on how serious the error was, even gave a free return to the client the following year if they returned. Be truthful, honest, and own up to your mistakes. Take responsibility. You will win clients for life when you are truthful. You will lose clients when you try to cover up your mistakes.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 February 2011|Text=I had the opportunity/misfortune of repeating my first year, after I sold that practice in Georgia and moved to North Carolina to be closer to the aging in-laws.

Seven years ago I started my current practice and only did 49 returns that first year. I was trying to concentrate on financial planning and only wanted clients whom I did the investing work (that decision has been changed). I gave many dinner seminars to seniors to drum up investment work and a number of them did come to me for taxes. I dripped on those seminar attendees for three years, each year getting a few more converts. Luckily, I had cash from the sale of my GA practice to pay living expenses.

If you read about businesses that fail (80% fail within the first five years) you'll see that most fail because of undercapitilization. The owner doesn't have enough money to pay living expenses without taking out of his business, and the business doesn't have enough customers to pay both expenses and the owner. So Lession #1 is to have other resources.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=15 February 2011|Text=Wow Kevin....exactly what I was looking for....thank you so much. There is a walmart/kmart/sams club parking lot nearby with my name on it.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Dealsam1|Date=15 February 2011|Text=This is also my first year and I am working PT from home. I am in a pretty good situation in my FT job as the Accountant at a major university. The place I work has over 200 employees and as the accountant, I am familiar to many of them. I sent out an email on the electronic bulletin board and I have had pretty good success so far drumming up business. As of today, I have prepared 13 returns (12 individual and one non profit). I hope to reach about 50 this first year. Any thing over that is gravy.

I purchased the PPR version of Drake software because I really had no idea how many clients I would have. I already owned a laptop (which is technically my wife's, but I have taken it over until April 18th) and a laser printer. The only big purchase I have had to make is a scanner, which wasn't really that much. I want to keep my costs pretty low and average about $160 per return I prepare.

Being on the college campus, I hope to pick up additional 990 business from a copule of frats and other student organizations as the year progresses. I have a total of 4 so far with one other decent prospect in June.

So I am not sure if this was helpful at all. I am really in a pretty unique situation with a majority of my cleints coming from the place where I am employed on a full time basis.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Zokan|Date=15 February 2011|Text=BTax2010 this is also my first year in my own office. The very first thing I did was to seek out a mentor; this was about a year and a half ago. She has 30+ years experience and has always been there to answer any questions I have. Having a good mentor can be invaluable. At end of 2010 I passed the enrolled agent exam and immediately applied to take the consultant exam in the state of Oregon. I received my license in January of this year. I rented an office on the main street through town for 200.00 a month. Things have been slow for me also. I found two clients on my own. I have gotten two from my mentor, she isn’t taking new clients anymore and I have had one walk in. I need to hit the street and visit businesses like Kevin did but I hate doing that type of thing. Starvation is going to make going door to door looking for work not seem so bad……haha}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 February 2011|Text=I would say "don't get discouraged when you pass out business cards an no one seems interested." Many people don't even keep your business card because they don't have an immediate need for you. That's why you have to go back every so often (I returned every 3 months). And don't be pushy. All I did was to introduce myself, say that I did accounting and taxes for businesses and individuals, and ask that they pass on the card to the owner (if he/she wasn't readily available). I got more than one client from the customers of the people I was calling on who happened to overhear my conversation and ask if they could also have a card.

People need to file their taxes. Many people are dissatisfied with their current arrangement and would change IF ONLY they could find someone who seemed personable. Smile.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=15 February 2011|Text=Dealsam1....you situation is unique....I couldn't imagine sending an email at my full-time job soliciting tax prep from my co-workers would go over very will with my employer (I am an Engineer full-time, so my fear is that it would raise questions about my desire to remain employed there...not only that but it raises a lot of concerns as far as me as an employee outside of HR getting into everyones salary info and whatnot)....there are a few people who have come across my Linked-in Profile at work and some of them have visited my website, but I have not solicited anyone there....

I also started out on a shoestring budget....I didn't buy any equipment and I am using Proseries Basic 50.

Zokan....I tend to be more of a loner, but a mentor is a good idea. Another thing to add to my list for the Chamber of Commerce. Maybe I could find someone there, or through SCORE......As far as hating the door to door thing....look into your local Chamber of Commerce....you have to get out in front of these folks and be persistent....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CrowJD|Date=15 February 2011|Text=I can't say "NO" loudly enough! Stay away from the Chamber of Horrors. There's nothing but a bunch of old duds that hang around there or eager beavers. Both of them will do you in.

Join the gym (if you are already fit). Never join the gym if you're out of shape, you'll end up being seen as a loser. If you're in good shape, strut around like you are on top of the world and hand out flippant advice.

The key with modern Americans is to make everthing sound easy. Don't bore people with the truth. Read the French and Italian magazines so you know what's going on in Europe (even if you don't speak the language, you can still understand the names). You can buy them at Barnes and Noble (they weigh 5lbs each). Come across as the high dollar sort. Your fees are sky high and so on and they'll flock to you. Shave your underarms and your chest and everything else so you don't come across as a cad. Try not to smell when you work out.

Rent a Mercedes and take the rental sticker off with turpentine and then stick it back on when you're thru with Superglue. Always show up at the gym in a nice car (or an old truck) and flashing a big white smile (it doesn't hurt to wear expensive sunglasses). If you can't afford a nice car, definitely go with an old truck. If you're young, never be caught dead in a van, even if you have 6 kids.

Just remember to keep it simple with people. You know they tax plan they need, tell them it's easy. Tell them they'll pay no tax (because they WANT to hear it, even though they don't believe it). It's a game but let them play it. A funeral director doesn't sell to the dead, he sells to the living!

Keep gadgets around and have the newest trinkets if you want to attract the young set. Have your nails done, particularly your toes. Go to the fanciest nail salon in the richest part of town. It's not that you want your nails done, it's that you want to be SEEN having them done. You won't make it as a young male (yes male) executive without being seen having a pedicure. Wear Italian sandles to show off your toes. Yes, I'm serious.

If you have pretty hair, alternate from wearing a crew cut to wearing a pony tail (don't spend less than $70 on your haircut). If you can pull off a tasteful cowboy hat, wear it but don't overdo it (step on it two or three times so it looks real). Cowboy hats are in this year. Try to look wistful and uninterested in everything if you can. Try to only smile at rich people (it takes a while to learn who's rich and who's not).

Don't go to church for anything but sex (like most young people), but if you meet someone wealthy who's ok, marry them for their money (if they're stupid, that's icing on the cake). Try them out first in the woods at the church picnic (you might want to spray a little OFF around your private parts first if you're not used to the outdoors). If you're already married, forget I said this.

Go to a megachurch if you can (it's good for business). Talk the talk.

This is what I would tell any young executive, particularly the self employed.

P.S. If you are not ready for the gym right now, start on a Slim Fast diet today. If you have the slightest grey in your hair, have a good dye job done this week. Far better to do this than to waste your time (and money) at the Chamber of Horrors. I'm very serious about this.

If you're older, have your doctor give you the highest possible dose of testosterone patch (wear two) and get an RX for HGH as well. Whatever you do, DO NOT listen to your family or friends. Remember, even Jesus had to leave town before he amounted to anything. Go to the chiropractor, sounds odd, but a lot of rich hypchondriacs hang out at the chiropractors office.

This might all sound very shallow (and it is) but you'll never win fighting modern America. Expect failure repeatedly. Expect it and you can deal with it. People get in trouble when they expect instant success.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wkstaxprep|Date=15 February 2011|Text=First few years were tough. did many trial and error advertising methods, some were creative and worked others were creaitve and didn't work.

get the word out your a tax professional, send letters to friends and acquaintances, be social, ask former colleagues who may have returns that are too small for their firm if they would be interested in handing over those returns to you (maybe even a small buy out), when you get a referral send a personally handwritten thank you card to person who referred the cleint, always make sure current clients are happy (this does not necessarily mean a low fee by any means) with your service and they will spread the word, go to networking meetings, work per diem for a firm until you get enough cleitns for yourself, and on and on good luck !!!! }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=NewYorkEA|Date=February 15, 2011|Text=I started part time from a home office. I put up a cheap website, put a $200 ad in a local newspaper, and used Craig's List. The newspaper ad got me 3 clients. Craig's List got me most of the clients though. A few found me online on their own. I did around 40 individual and 2-3 S Corp/partnerships. Of the 40 individuals, 10 were relatives. I was also able to pick up some write-up/bookkeeping clients. I also sent out letters to new businesses every once in a while. Growth continued steadily for a few years.

Then I decided I wanted big growth. So I rented an office, got a CPA Site Solutions website (and added a separate feature that allowed people to book and confirm appointments online), re-named/re-branded my company, and started heavily marketing my practice. I used Craig's List, PPC, Yellowpages.com premium listings, sent out A LOT of direct mail, handed out flyers, hired a human directional, and raised my fees quite a bit. My revenue tripled that year. My expenses went up too, but they did not triple and most of those clients came back the next year.

I think that direct mail (if done properly) and a great website (as well as ways for people to find your website) are the way to go. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 February 2011|Text=What did the 'human directional' wear/hold/do?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=NewYorkEA|Date=February 15, 2011|Text=They had regular clothes on. I can't remember exactly what the sign said. It was something like TAXES in large letters and then Fast & Affordable under that. The signs were rather large, with bold/bright colors. A local sign shop made them for a nice price. They also had handles on the back. The human directional did not bring me a ton of business. After a while I stopped doing that and had the employee help me with the direct mail instead since I did it in house. Maybe if I was in a retail center on a bigger street it would have been better.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=16 February 2011|Text=Thanks for all of the great responses everybody and keep it coming to those who haven't commented. I've come away with a few ideas based on your contributions and I will definitely report back on my results.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wahoo|Date=16 February 2011|Text=I am year 2. Year one was rough but if you focus on getting your name out there, meeting people, and staying in front of people you will see dividends. YTD, I am exponentially busier this year- I might even be able to make a living at this. I am a firm believer in having an office space, even if in an executive office space that can be rented by the day, hour, etc to meet with clients. As has been said on numerous threads, don't make the mistake of pricing too low at the start or you will be paying that price for years to come. I am already adjusting upward from year one and wish I had started with higher fees.

Internet marketing and a strong web site have helped. That being said, there are a lot of solely priced based shoppers that troll the internet. IMHO, they are not even worth the time and effort it takes to respond to them via email.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=MaxTax|Date=16 February 2011|Text=In my first year I struggled too. I'm in year 2. I kept the price too low last year to attract clients. Whoever showed up last year demanding the same price this year too. I'm slowly increasing the price upwards. I wish I started last year with higher fees too.
My business is picking up but not the exponential growth I was expecting. Since I do this parttime, I envision this to be parttime for a while. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Lisaw|Date=16 February 2011|Text=In my first year of taking clients on my own, but also committed to "up to" 35-40 hours a week with a CPA who has been mentoring me. I was hesitant to do much marketing as I didnt know how much time I would have for my own clients and figured that one more year worth of experience doing lots of returns would benefit me in the long run.

So far I definitely regret not putting more time into my own marketing. I didnt take into account that my increased competency would mean less hours necessary at the other gig (this is the second day this week I was asked to not come in since I had completed most of the available returns assigned to me). This didnt happen last year. It is early in the season so this will hopefully change.

In regards to the clients I do have, I have had good luck with referals from a realtor. The clients are mostly first time home buyers that want someone to calculate their recommended witholding allowances. I havent charged for this and it has been easy to convert them to clients.

On the subject of the gym - while it may have been made in jest - I did get one client from someone I met sitting on the bike next to me.

I will defintiely jump both feet in for next season, including possibly buying a small practice if I find the right one.

Best of luck to everyone!
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Craigums|Date=16 February 2011|Text=I am year one. Listen to Kevinh5. I am busier than expected. Read the following books:

Six pixels of separation by Mitch Joel

The Referral Engine by John Jantsch

Follow their advice.

Also, local search engine optimization is ripe for the picking. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wkstaxprep|Date=16 February 2011|Text=Lisaw,

one thought came to my mind reading your post and that is it bothers me when I see quality tax pros getting underpaid because they are efficient. i feel that you should be getting paid more on a fee percentage than an hourly rate if that is indeed the case. where's the incentive? if you have become more experinced this year and are preapring the returns more efficiently this year, why should that hurt you income wise? I hope your mentor has adjusted your pay to reflect the increased production and value you provide for his practice. best of luck. i also don't personally like charging based on time and/or per forms, but each has their own method of course.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Lisaw|Date=16 February 2011|Text=Wkstaxprep thanks for the feedback. My hourly pay was increased this year but is probably still underpriced for an EA. There are lots of benefits to working there, primarily in the area of free consultation for my own clients and the opportunity to work on some challenging returns. I dont think I am being taken advantage of, but do think I planned poorly from a time management point of view. I like your idea of a fee percentage - I will keep it in mind for next year - I am keeping the door open for 2-3 days a week next year.

Craigums - thanks for repeating Kevins list. I will get on it - apparently I may have the time:)

Lisa}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CrowJD|Date=17 February 2011|Text=You can get more business from the gym than you can the Chamber of Horrors. I guess in some towns the Chamber might be ok, but the main purpose of a Chamber is to perpepuate mediocrity.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=17 February 2011|Text=Excellence is a better teacher than mediocrity. The lessons of the ordinary are everywhere. Truly profound and original insights are to be found only in studying the exemplary.

- Warren G. Bennis

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CrowJD|Date=17 February 2011|Text=Warren I agree with you. Oh it's Kevin. Well I agree with both of you.

If you don't like the gym, become a knitter. You can wear what you knit even if it looks terrible. Anything goes in fashion now, the crazier the better. Join one or two knitting clubs.

If I had any talent, I would knit, but I really don't have any talents.

With food prices going up, I predict an end to obesity in America in around 5 years. The whole topic will be passe. We'll all be thin as a rail.

So you could look into a farmer's club and grow your own food and meet people that way. Anything but the Chamber of Horrors. If you like to work on cars, join a car club (you won't be able to afford the gasoline, so they'll be plenty of time to talk).

P.S. By the way, get your hands on some old seeds (heirloom or whatever). The big conglomerates are trying to patent all the seeds and you'll have to pay $10.00 for one seed, even a mustard seed. It will be like prescription drugs.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=17 February 2011|Text=So I went to the "Chamber of Horrors" meeting this morning. It was ok. Not bad, but didn't necessarily blow my hair back. I understand what CrowJD is getting at....the folks there are not necessarily looking to be referral sources.....for me though every small business owner is a potential client, but I need to be in the right group....these folks were a bit stuffy for me and I thing if I did join a Chamber, a smaller one might actually serve me better.....

Anyway, my first year is still underway....I've got some fliers to print....
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CrowJD|Date=17 February 2011|Text=I'm sure there are some good Chambers, however, I think any "hobby" or other type association might offer more benefits as far as meet & greet (since you might actually enjoy the hobby). Of course, keep in mind, I'm not an expert on this since I went bust in the tax business. I decided after it was over that I would rather sell myself out to the medical profession for experimentation than to do taxes. :)

"And over hill and vale we went,

And many fliers left to print,

And many fliers left to print."

Robert Frost (he keeps coming back to me).}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Taxaway|Date=17 February 2011|Text=I was in a very fortunate situation for my first year, with a small number of clients I could count on before starting up, and used a time-share conference room. Also lucky, since I could lock up my computer/printer within the room.

I think the most important thing is to establish a personal but still professional connection to your clients, and referrals will follow. My business has grown because of that, without any direct active marketing, (just indirect like Google and Yahoo listings which I doubt has done anything).

BT, it's surprising that some of your own family members went elsewhere, maybe that was just a one-time necessity to get the 'fast money'? Do they understand your credentials of being an EA, that you're not just a guy that can prepare taxes, this is your profession, a real business?

I would also not offer referral fees right away (except if someone referred a number of new clients)...they should feel lucky you have time to help them.

You have to sell yourself first: your abilities, knowledge of tax law, concern for your clients, level of confidentiality, etc. You want clients to choose you based on that connection rather than them just choosing elsewhere based on a lower price or closer tax shop.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=17 February 2011|Text=Taxaway,

Thanks for the tips....yeah, it is surprising and unfortunate....I just had another one....a family member who I have helped quite a bit over the years with filling out Fafsa's and anything else she needed.....this was one of the first people I told that I was starting the biz this year....she's been talking to me back and forth since August....asked for fliers to had out to friends that she supposedly told about me.....went to Block and paid $300 for a return that I would have done for $50....she had a W-2 and a 1099G for UE....

The truth is that my network is not very "sophisticated" financially or otherwise for that matter....I have resigned myself to the fact that I will not have that base to work with, so it will be a slower build for me to start this business.....I am more disappointed in them and sad for them than anything else...I will be fine, it will just take time, patience, and persistence....all of those are free....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=17 February 2011|Text=So the real question is 'why would we do a $300 return for $50' when they don't even appreciate our family relationship?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=17 February 2011|Text=Kevin, I agree...we wouldn't....fortunately this does not represent all of my family....but I see now that I have to start setting the proper expectations....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wkstaxprep|Date=17 February 2011|Text=how did Block charge $300 for a return with one w-2 and one 1099-g? interesting. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=17 February 2011|Text=Part piracy and part customer stupidity....I think she got suckered by the "Free" simple tax return offer....can't imagine a return much simpler than hers...even the fees for a state return shouldn't climb that high....refund is being received in 8-14 days....Block knows what it can get away with when it comes to its client base....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=AtlProfAcctg|Date=17 February 2011|Text=Where is the best place to find small businesses who need your services?

Let them find you. And over 40 million of them use QuickBooks. There is a little icon within the program that says "find an expert in your area". I get A LOT of calls from that little icon. A LOT. (Becoming a Certified ProAdvisor is the way to end up with a listing on the website.)

Helping small businesses with their QB is a no brainer, in my opinion. Once I develop a relationship with them, 99% of them fire their current tax preparer without any urging from me. And then doing their taxes is much faster because I helped them set up their books correctly and I feel good about their numbers.

Once you're in the door, look at what else you can do for your small business clients. I started a 1099/W-2 service that does a brisk January business. And, if you pull the 1099 numbers from QB, you can start getting their tax info together to get a head start on the season. Then, the owners/partners ask you to do their personal returns, which is even easier because you can import the K-1s in an instant. Throughout the year they need help with their quarterly payroll tax filings, etc. And then you end up meeting their friends, and getting referrals....and so on.

Through my ProAdvisor listing I got hired to teach QB at a local university. And that has been a goldmine for me. Who attends that class? Small business owners and employees.....and now they all know a CPA.......

Good customer service is also key to keeping your clientele and getting referrals. I always ask clients why they want to make a change and these are the most common responses:

* I could never get my current tax preparer to answer my calls or call me back.
* My current tax preparer makes me feel stupid for asking questions.
* I don't like my current tax preparer.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=NewYorkEA|Date=February 17, 2011|Text=Your experiences with the ProAdvisor listing are very different from mine and others I have heard. When I was listed on their website the only contacts I got were from people price shopping. And the problem with QuickBooks work is that there is always going to be someone willing to do it for $10 an hour.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=17 February 2011|Text=Becoming a QB ProAdvisor is on my list of things to check into, but as NewYorkEA said it seems to be less then a sure thing.

Atl....as I understand it, the listings are ranked correct...how does your listing rank effect the number of calls you receive? Also, how do you improve your listing rank....If I am mistaken in this exactly how does the program work...}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=AtlProfAcctg|Date=18 February 2011|Text=I list pretty high--on the first page of most searches. But that depends on your certification level and the number of feedback entries---I did the research in year #1 to make sure I would be listed as high as possible. If you start now, you can get certified for 2011 and also 2010 until mid-summer or so. Then in 2012 you are eligible to take the advanced test (after three years of regular certification).

If you take the time to make your profile look attractive to clients, they will call you. Then it's up to you to get the business at the price that works for you. When you are starting, you need to start somewhere. Think big picture--you're not just going in for a few hundred dollars--you want to be their go-to financial services source. If you have to take a profit hit getting in there for the first time, it could be worth your while if you add value to their business.

I'm actually building a network of a few lower-priced bookkeepers who will do QB for $15-20 an hour for my clients who need everyday, on-site type help. Then I come in for higher level review, reconciliation, consulting, etc.

QuickBooks is a big outfit....using their customers for leverage makes sense. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Xz|Date=24 February 2011|Text=Too busy to read every post - will do after the season. Just want to share with you. This is my second year in business and I am very busy. A lot busier than last year. Try every marketing you can think of. Last year so many times I wanted to quit and look for a job, but now I have a very good vision of my business' growth. Don't only rely on family and friends. The big crowd is out there. They are actually easier to deal with. Will post more after the season. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Jimi|Date=24 February 2011|Text=The QB ProAdvisor program has worked for me. More than once a business tax client has said they chose me because I knew QBs. I get inquiries regularly. Some are good and some are bad.

You have to understand how the rankings work. Use the QB forum to get some insight. Intuit thinks a picture of yourself and ratings are high priority criteria. The ratings are mostly bogus. I have only seen one person with a less than a 5 star rating. Feeling like a third grader saying "I will be your best friend", I asked some clients to post a rating for me.

To add to what AtlProAcctg posted, you can get certified in 2010 and 2011 now through early summer. Testing for 2012 should begin in November 2011. So between now and November you could qualify for the advanced certification. Do not confuse years of time with years of versions. You need to be certified in 3 versions, not certified for 3 years of time to take the advanced test. In any competitive market you need to have the advanced certification to rank high.
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fr. Mackelhenry|Date=24 February 2011|Text=Came in like a lion, went out like a lamb.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=24 February 2011|Text=Xz, thanks for taking the time. I look forward to your comments after tax season. Jimi, thanks for your comments on QB as well. Right now I am gearing up for a pretty decent marketing push. I am keeping it simple, I have created a flyer and I will be hanging one on every mailbox in my subdivision, about 200 homes. I ordered some doorhanger poly bags from Uline (cheaper than actual printed doorhangers) so I will at least get my name out across my local neighborhood.

I will also be doing some direct mail to new businesses in my county, and I also plan to visit small businesses in my area, particularly any place that I patronize. If I could pick up just a few clients then it will be well worth it.

As far as the QB Pro Advisor, I have been giving it a lot of thought, and I am pretty sure I am going to pursue it after tax season. I am also starting to seriously think about pursuing a CPA license sometime over the next 2 years or so. I do believe the EA is an excellent credential, but the one thing that bothers me is not being able to provide audited financial statements to my small business clients, and I see this as being an issue long term.

I could essentially outsource that business to a CPA, but I would like to have the ability to provide as much as I can under my own roof. Pursuing a CPA would also enhance my accounting background since I don't have much. I do have an MBA and I took the required accounting course with that, but my Bachelors degree is in Mechanical Engineering. While I am quite naturally numbers oriented, I know I will need a bit more formal accounting training in order to properly service my small business clients. Good CPE would probably get me there, but if I have to do it anyway I may as well get another credential out of it so that is my thought process right now. We'll see where it goes....

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=8 March 2011|Text=So I took some of the advice from this thread and put myself out there a little more using traditional means....I put together a one page letter with a business card and place it in one of those plastic bags they use to hang stuff on your doorknob....I then walked my subdivision and put it on the flag of every mailbox in the neighborhood...about 183 homes....only took me an hour and the weather was pleasant...

A few people were out and about so I was able to hand it to them personally.....I noticed a small blip on the website traffic...no calls, but now everyone in my subdivision knows what I do....all of our kids go to school together and participate in activities together so it was not a lost effort....and I got some exercise....next target: Small Businesses.....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=9 March 2011|Text=my first year(1985): $20,000 revenue, $6,000 Schedule C net. 100% Hand-prepared returns. Bought first IBM PC with a 20mg hard drive, MS-DOS 2.1 (maybe). Thought it was impossible to ever fill up that hard drive. DUAL 5.25" floppies. Two small children, plus two foster kids, stay-at-home wife. Mortgage. Fun times. Will never forget them.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=94nole|Date=9 March 2011|Text=Doesn't it just crack you up how awesome we thought those computers were? IT'S BECAUSE THEY WERE AWESOME in 1985!!! 20MB HD in 1985 was absolutely cutting edge.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Flybynight|Date=9 March 2011|Text=Remember when Bill Gates said we would never need more than 512kb of RAM? Excel alone takes at least 10x that now. Maybe I can find an old copy of Lotus 123...}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Zokan|Date=9 March 2011|Text=''.next target: Small Businesses.....''

I finally pushed myself out the door. Went to about 15 local businesses and got one "I will call you when I get my stuff together, I've been looking for a new accountant." Do you guys do follow ups with people that seem interested? or wait till they get their stuff together?

Tomorrow door to door all day....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=9 March 2011|Text=Zokan,

I would give him a few days and then follow-up....nothing too intrusive, you don't want to spook him....maybe drop a postcard in the mail like what the dentists/doctors do to remind you of your appointment.....remind him that you talked and let him know that if he has any questions feel free to call....include another business card to reinforce who you are.....there is a reason he is looking for another accountant....from reading on here a lot of times it seems that people complain about a lack of communication....let him know that he has your attention...}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wkstaxprep|Date=9 March 2011|Text=TaxAway your Feb 17th post above, I could not have said it any better myself. Very well put!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wkstaxprep|Date=9 March 2011|Text=As for doing Taxes for friends and family, I got some simple advice a few years ago but it seems like great advice as far as i am concerned. I was told that when we Tax Professionals do work for family and friends the pricing goes one of two ways. You either charge full price or you do it for free.

I really like that philosophy. It seems most problems arise when work is done for family/friends and we charge somewhere in between.

Thats been my experience anyway and this above advice has helped me very well so hopefully it helps others on here.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Suomalainen|Date=March 10, 2011|Text=I’m new too, well since 3/10. Did 8 paid returns last year (and moonlighted as a volunteer for VITA AARP and worked as a branch manager for Liberty so I really did about 150 returns). This tax season, I have my own business up and going (9 paid, 12 more in the queue, my old clients getting ready to file with me again, and moonlighting as a tax checker for a CPA in a distant town, and I will do the VITA AARP thing again).

So far, how I started and ideas to share - - -

First year accomplishments
Developed a mission statement
Opened bank account
Bought software
Bought business cards, stationary, folders
Got friends that used the same software, and more experience
Got CPA friend to be a backup for when I needed help.
Got PTIN, EIN, ERO
Developed Client Checklist
Learned not to sell to friends and family
Tripped over NATP on Facebook and joined
Attended the Summer Training, and the fall 2010 get ready for the tax year 2010 season

Second year accomplishments
> My web site is up and running.
> 4200 flyers are under windshield wipers at apartments, condos, WalMart, K Mart, county offices, parks, restaurants, country clubs and hospitals. (If I move, I can get 400 out in an hour, and have 5 clients from it).
> I'm advertising in the local paper Sunday and Thursday (expensive, about $1000 / for 4 weeks of Sunday Thursday, and we’re getting hits from it)
> Have a free ad on Craigslist
> Have an ad in the local insurance company’s paper, 250 employees
> Contacted three 75+ year old preparers to help with their e filing
> I'm in the local Coffee News. No hits there.
> Have a silent partner, a local CPA, who s great at answering questions for me, and helping when I get over my head.
> Have e fax up and running (all faxes come in as pdfs). I try to save no paper. Keep all client data in PDFs.
> The iPhone is an incredible time saver and help for maps and contact data.
> ProSeries is up and running.
> A local tax preparer 10 miles away with 500 plus customers also uses ProSeries. We’ve agreed to be friends and help with ProSeries issues.
> Have a part time job at a CPA firm checking taxes so I stay sharp. I get to ask questions there.
> Have a local small town where their only Pizza place puts my advertising flyer / coupon on every pizza that goes out the door.
> Had 8 paying customers last year. 7 will be back. I've contacted them all, and they are helping with their friends, neighbors, relatives.
> Volunteer at AARP / VITA in their tax assistance program for seniors.
> Have an engagement letter, privacy policy, and 8 page questionnaire I work through with the client. We both sign off on it as our agreed scope.
> Keep digital / pdf files for W2s, 1099s, the engagement letter and questionnaire, 8879's, and tax returns.
> Keep a back up copy of my hard disk.
> I’ve stopped in at local businesses and a couple have invited me in to talk to their employees.
> And I'm proud to have several NATP friends where we bounce around ideas and thoughts about issues and how to be better
> Have a daughter who is boundaryless with ideas and suggestions

Summary - get out and let folks know you are in business. Don't go for friends and relatives, and if you do, do them free. Relationships, referrals, and service.

Good luck all. Thanks for sharing.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=26 March 2011|Text=So I put some of the advice in this thread to use and I have had some good results so far. First, I printed up a letter for all of the people in my subdivision and went house to house and hung them on the flags of the mailboxes (about 185 letters). I had a plastic door hanger bag with the letter and a business card inside. It generated a little bit of website traffic, but not calls.

I then discovered that I had access to a public records database through my public library. It is normally a paid service, so the access through the library was not as convenient. I did a search on small business filings in my county. I could only download 50 at a time and it was in the form of a PDF file. I did the search on businesses that were filed starting in November of 2010 and just kept going back until I had 500 records. That took me back to about July. I also had ordered Dan Kennedy's Ultimate Sales Letter book and I used it to learn how to put together a basic sales letter.

I kept the letter to one page in order to keep my expenses down even though Kennedy suggests that longer is better. I had them color printed at The UPS Store and then I printed my envelopes with the 500 business names that I had typed individually into an Excel spreadsheet. On each envelope I had wrote "Please Respond" with a felt tip marker and I put an actual stamp on each envelope.

With the help of my wife and kids I got through about half of the letters on one night and mailed those out the next day. The next day we finished stuffing the rest and I mailed those out as well. I should also mention that I had set up an answering service to take my calls on a seasonal basis (the service is out of Minnesota and I had used them some years ago when I was a Mortgage Broker in Minnesota. They do a good job and they are affordable). I have it set up so that they schedule appointments for me to call potential clients back between 6:30 and 9:00pm in 30 minute intervals.

The first call came in on the third day and the person scheduled an appointment to speak with me that evening. He is a landscaper and he did about $1k in business last year on the side. He is planning to go full time this year and he hit me up for a few questions on what to do, but he was not ready to have any tax prep work done. I answered his questions and plan to follow up, but I must say that at the time I was a bit disappointed.

Then, last night I get my schedule and I have two more appointments scheduled, one for 7:30pm last night and the other at noon today. The client last night said that she was looking for a new tax pro because the current person she works with is not responsive and doesn't return calls promptly, a very common complaint mentioned here on Taxalmanac. I sent her my tax organizer and I will give her a day or two to complete it and then we will schedule a time to meet face to face. She had a few questions including if I was set up with the Better Business Bureau....I am not so I sent here to the IRS website so that she can make an inquiry about my EA status. She also had questions about deducting a home office, and about the treatment of sales tax for online retailers both of which I had plenty of info to share and I will also do some research as well.

The client today just wanted to schedule a time to meet face to face. She didn't have any questions at all. They had someone in California doing their taxes apparently for the last 5 years. The got my letter at just the right time as they were looking for someone local. I followed the same procedure, got her email address and sent my organizer. I will be giving her a call on Monday to schedule a face to face meeting.

Overall I am pretty happy with my results. I made a flat fee offer for small business tax prep and I put a response deadline of 4/1/11 in order to lock in the price, so I may very well get more appointments scheduled between now an then. I was a bit skeptical as to if my letter was a bit late since we are in the thick of tax season, but I made an appeal to the fact that the deadline is approaching (in the mind of the client it is anyway) hoping that I would shake loose the procrastinators or those looking for a new tax pro and it worked out well. Judging by the response and considering it was my first sales letter ever, I will very likely do this type of mailing every year at this time to try and add new clients.

Thanks to everyone here for your advice. Also thanks to everyone in the following two threads, I refer back to these regularly when I have marketing questions....

http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:Response_Rates_for_1040_postcard_mailers%3F

http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:Marketing_letters
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=AtlProfAcctg|Date=27 March 2011|Text=Honestly, I would re-think your goal to prepare audited financials for your clients. I did audits for 8+ years at a Big 4 and Huge Regional CPA firm, and I would NEVER consider doing audits in my own practice.

Way too much risk, unless you hire someone to review your work and agree to sign off as such. Also, audits are typically contracted on a fixed-fee basis, so any problems that arise (and there are A LOT of problems on EVERY audit if you know what you are doing) end up eating your profit margin. Companies who are required to issue audited financials who price-shop for services with a sole practictioner are EXACTLY the audit clients that you want to avoid.

Preparing compiled and reviewed statements is more in line with what you are looking for, I think. And even then you have to undergo a peer review of your client files. I wouldn't recommend doing reviews on your own, either, without doing time at a local firm at the very least, so you can learn from people with years of experience and get some perspective.

Sorry to be a killjoy, but I've been there and done that, and sometimes it ain't pretty.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=28 March 2011|Text=AtlProfAcctg....uhhhh....did you post to the wrong thread by mistake??? Who said anything about audited financials???

Anyway, looks like I just got a crash course lesson in not counting your eggs before they hatch....both of these "potential clients" bailed on me....and ironically they both used almostethe same exact excuse..... Potential #1 - "I talked to my husband and since our business is just getting started and our return will probably be simple he is just going to do it himself..." - So why did you call me???

Potential #2 - "I talked to my husband and he is decided to use another accountant"

It sucks but it happens I guess....on a brighter note I just had a family friend come on board last night....I also picked up another client from church, and had multiple people asking for my contact info at church as well so word of mouth is definitely beating out my marketing efforts so far....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CrowJD|Date=28 March 2011|Text=You didn't do badly. Some of those people will keep your letter and you could get a call from them months later. Those two that come over were probably looking for sex. But you never know that could call back for tax work. The economy is still not great so keep that in mind.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=28 March 2011|Text=Thanks Crow....yes I had a conversation with a local tax professional that I met at the Chamber of Commerce meeting I attended....he was nice enough to share some of his own insights and experiences being a local tax and accounting guy....he told me that in many instances he did business with people he had talked to years earlier, and they for whatever reason remembered him and got in touch....my lesson in patience continues...}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=6 April 2011|Text=So a quick update....the flyers that I put on mailboxes in the community in early March paid off after all....received 2 appointments over the past weekend and I am picking up docs tonight from one of those.....a sole proprietor who owns a painting business....also, my 500 piece direct mail piece generated 4 appointments, 1 of those will be a client and I should be receiving docs by the end of the week on that one....and my Estate Income Tax Return client just referred me to a friend who needs a variety of services....basic bookkeeping setup, 501(c)(3) paperwork.....looking good for the first year so far...}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Robfurr|Date=7 April 2011|Text=This is actually my 3rd year, but thought I'd chime in. My 1st year I did about 35 returns, mostly family, coworkers, folks from church, with a handful of referrals. 2nd year I did about 45, picked up a few more referrals. Did no advertising, mailings, or anything other than word of mouth. This year I gave out a few business cards, had some signs made to put on street corners, on track to do between 55-60 returns. Have some very good clients who say they will come back next year, a handful of returns that have really challenged my skills, but overall very pleased.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Davidcpa412|Date=7 April 2011|Text=This is my 2nd year. I made A LOT of mistakes my first year. The first one was listening to a partner I used to work with during my time at McGladrey. Newspaper ads, flyers, direct mail yield very, very low response rates. Chambers of Commerce = waste of time. I struggled my 1st year due to these mistakes. Last summer I dedicated all my free time to marketing and sales research. Online marketing (google ads, social media) is where its at. It works. In 2010 I made $35k gross. I just reviewed my numbers and I am at $105k gross in just my first 3 months. Picked up complex 1040's, small businesses, bookkeeping, 2 audits, a few compilations and some consulting type work. The growth has been challenging. I had to hire 2 temps from Accountemps and a full time assistant to handle all the calls coming in, appointment setting, and various admin work. I am now going to hire a PR professional to start doing seminars, webinars for established businesses in a few target industries.

Hope my comments help.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Zokan|Date=7 April 2011|Text=Hi Davidcpa412, can you share more about what you did online with google ads and social media? maybe some links?

Thanks}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Davidcpa412|Date=7 April 2011|Text=Send me an email Zokan and I will get back to you after the 18th.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=7 April 2011|Text=David,

If you don't mind I would like to send you an email as well to get some insight into what you did. My experience has been somewhat opposite. The Chamber was a total waste, however Google Adwords and Craigslist yielded absolutely no results for me.....Facebook and Twitter - Nada....I am sure a big part of that has to do with my paltry investment in the Google Adwords account, but I can't say that I have a warm fuzzy about PPC for our type of business, and this is coming from a guy who's business is set up to be largely internet based.

With the Flyers and Direct Mail while the response was low it was at least something, and the investment was small to modest respectively. I just picked up a Sole Proprietor client who's fee is more than triple what I paid for the flyers....for the Direct Mail I can't complain about the response....We scheduled 4 appointments as a result of a 500pc mailing....a 0.8% response rate, which is slightly higher than the average 0.6%.

Of those I was able to convert 1 into a client, and 1 is a possibility as he was in an early planning stage and will be diving into his landscaping biz full-time this year. Financially not quite the best investment looking at first year revenue only but 1 - I need to do a better job converting these and 2 - If the 1 client returns next year and/or I am able to covert the possible I will consider this effort to have been a moderate success and a good learning experience either way.

Anyway, I would love to have some success with Online Marketing....I do believe this is where we are headed, but I don't think I quite know how to implement it properly.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DJCCPA|Date=7 April 2011|Text=This is my first year in business as well and I'm on personal return #22 and I just signed a contract with a small business for tax preparation/consulting/bookkeeping for a monthly retainer. One thing that may have helped me was that I started in July, 2010. I had $2,200 in revenue from preparing financials for business plans, a few LLC creations, and a few 990's. But I had six months to network and advertise. I hand out business cards like candy ~ even the sales guy when my mother bought furniture. We talk financing, yes, I'm an accountant, and oh, here if you ever need anything. I've tried a little bit of everything advertising-wise and I track how many clients/phone calls I get from each. The best results thus far? ~ Craigslist and hanging a flyer/cards at my son's karate studio. Craigslist can be a pain because you get a certain share of oddities but perfect example of the payoff? The small biz I just signed was a referral from one of their employees who found me on Craigslist. I spent $20.00 on an online local county listing. I did an 8 week print ad in the county circular ~ that translated into two clients, both elderly without computers. Another client from "liking" my FB business page. Family? LOL I learned long ago not to be offended that my husband has a HUGE family who would rather go to HR Block. My own mother seems to forget what I do ~ every day she calls, "What are doing today?" LOL I'm very fortunate that my husband has the full time job so that I can take my time building this. I couldn't imagine trying to support myself on this income right now. I did do a postcard direct mail campaign that generated zero results but it wasn't terribly expensive. Vistaprint ~ design your own postcard, you can buy a targeted mailing list from them (I selected "new homeowners" within 5 miles of my zip code thinking they may have moved away from their old preparer), and you can even have them mail them for you. Under $100 for 200 postcards including the postage and I get to keep the address database.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=RonnieEA|Date=8 April 2011|Text=I was thinking on starting my own business next year. I been working for a small tax and bookkeeping business in California (during tax season) for 4 years. The owner has been in business for 20 years as a CTEC. I just got my EA and all most done with my CPA exams (Pass 3 of the 4). I am also graduating from Golden Gate University this year with a Masters in Taxation. I been trying to get into a small CPA firm, but I am having problems getting hired because of my age(46yrs old). I have found that most of the CPA around me only want to hire 25-35 year olds. I understand. Reading all the posting, I think it will be hard but in the long run it is very rewarding. When my boss started her business 15 years ago, she told me that she had only 15 clients the first year. She now has 682 clients(18% small business). she also has over 50 bookkeeping clients. I was hoping to one day take over her business but her son is now getting involved in the business and she has already told me that she would give it to him. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Leyenda|Date=18 April 2011|Text=Well, my first season has concluded. While disappointing, I'll take away some valuable lessons. I had worked 12 years in corporate accounting in a major metropolitan area, making a decent salary. Last fall, I left and moved to a small city of 200K people in the southern half of the US to be with wife and kids (wife started 3-year assignment last summer in this small city). Since decent jobs are scarce in the new city, and the fact that my schedule needs to be flexible because we have small children, and since we have a nice savings built up, I decided to get my EA and have a go at my own business (tax, bookkeeping, accounting). I leased a small office for the year and furnished with basic necessities (Desk, chairs, laptop computer, multi-purpose office machine, phone/internet setup, etc.).

Not counting relatives and friends from my old home, I had just 4 clients this season. My advertising results were as follows:
1) Church bulletin weekly ad started Jan. 20 for whole year (large Catholic church with 3,000+ practicing) - $475 for year, 0 clients
2) Direct Mail coupon to 40,000 residential addresses sent early March - $1,400, 1 client
3) Local B2B Mailing sent late March to 8,000 business contacts - $500, 1 client
4) Local newspaper classified ad for 30 days (Mar 15 - Apr 15) - $179, 1 client
5) Google profile and AdWords - $50, 20 clicks, 1 client
6) Self Mailing to local new businesses throughout January-April - About $500 in supplies/postage, 0 clients

During the off-season, I realize that I have to focus much more on networking and getting out to meet people. Because I was getting all my other stuff together during January and February, I got a late jump on advertising and most likely missed some of the early filers. Nevertheless, I have also noticed that very few CPAs and other tax preparers advertise in this city. That's definitely not the case in my old city. The other thing I learned is to have letterhead and envelopes printed professionally. I did a lot of printing myself this season to try to save a few hundred dollars, but the effort on this mundane task takes up a lot of energy (especially when you have low-volume equipment) that could be spent in other areas.

Just wanted to share my experience... It wasn't the start I wanted, but it's better than no start at all.
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Zokan|Date=19 April 2011|Text=Year 1
14 referrals from tax preparers no longer taking new clients-Need to talk to more old preparers it seems like the average age is about 106....okay maybe SLIGHT exaggeration.
2 walk ins
3 people I know
6 freebies for family

Average return 275.00

Still have a few extensions to do. Can't wait till next year!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=19 April 2011|Text=Wow....retiring tax practitioners.....just added them to my marketing target list.....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Lisaw|Date=21 April 2011|Text=Thought I would check back into this thread. Completed 15 returns of my own. Made enough money working for the CPA to get a small office nearby. Picked up one bookkeeping client from the CPA and will likely get a collections client as well. Have been busy with 2 new referal leads this week.

On a bad note, hard drive crashed on my 5 month old laptop April 19th!! I am in process of repairing the damage and getting up and running again. Also came to the conclusion that I cannot continue with Drake software. Will need to change for next year.

}}

The part of this discussion regarding software opinions was transferred to [[Discussion:2011_Tax_Prep_Software_Summary]]

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=22 April 2011|Text=what do you do (specifically) for a "collections client?"}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Lisaw|Date=23 April 2011|Text=Fletch - you asked specifically so my guy needs alot of work - Back tax returns need to be corrected and some are not filed. Needs holds on the collection process while it is sorted out and then will attempt to get him into a CNC status or at the very least a new installment agreement ( he is in default on the old one). He is considering all options and possible bankruptcy down the road. He is a repeat offender so will do my best to scare the living daylights out of him. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Taxoasis|Date=23 April 2011|Text=15 individual and 1 corporate return.

6 word of mouth.
3 Craigslist.
1 business card left at local car wash.
2 sign on car.
2 sent their spouses in.
2 google place page.

Postcard mailings yielded no clients.
Ad in local paper yielded no clients.
Fliers posted at stores yielded no clients.

Low rent and cheap office supplies are critical. Used Taxact professional which worked fine for me.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=24 April 2011|Text=@BT...from the very first post to this thread, you asked: ''"All posters please answer this question if you are so inclined: If you were building your practice and you could only use two marketing methods (one for individuals and one for small biz clients) what would they be?"'' 1. direct mail to target market. 2. Seek out centers of influence (bankers, P&C agents, realtors, Any CPE for any profession, attorneys, TPAs, Financial planners, health ins agents, IT firms.....i.e. VENDORS to your target market. Offer to give VALUABLE info and a free lunch paid by the COI, to their customers, such as a 30-45 minute presentation, "The 6 Secrets to Surviving Today's IRS Audits." At the presentation, pass around a yellow pad, page 1 pre-numbered: 1,2,3,4,5,6.....30 fill in the first two with Name, Address, Email. #1 id your name, etc....#2 is the COI's name address, etc. Offer "My Latest tax tips" to these folks if they sign up. Drip on them monthly until one of you dies. Around July, the drip should be an offer of a mid-year tax planning session. Around Sept, offer a clean-up-your-quickbooks discount deal. Around Thanksgiving, the drip should be an offer of a year-end tax planning meeting. Hmmmm, what might you offer in Jan or Feb?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=24 April 2011|Text=Also find additional services to offer to your existing clients after April 15th ! Doing this bridges the gap from survival to prosperity. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=25 April 2011|Text=Buy a tax practice if yÓu want to become very suCcessful quickly. }}

Discussion:What I/we did well vs what I/we need to improve on...

2011-04-24T15:47:41Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Jeff-Ohio|Date=20 April 2011|Text=A take-off from the 'results' topic, I am more curious on hearing feedback from where everyone succeeded vs. where you need to improve instead of the actual $$ talk in terms of revenues.

For example ' '''quit making promises after April 1''''' was mentioned in the former thread and I think that is brilliant. Another (for me and in a firm of 15) is to stop making plan to deliver a tax return without giving the staff ample time to prep and review. Rushing is where 99% of our mistakes occur.

Another - quit sending out tax returns (well, we had 1) that we know the client can't justify an expense - even if it's in writing - it will come back to bit us eventually.

Pros/cons lists?
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Jeff-Ohio|Date=21 April 2011|Text=Ok...lol.

What if I said What was your biggest challenge? What was your greatest success?

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CathysTaxes|Date=21 April 2011|Text=My greatest success was getting all clients to agree to efile. I'm not at the 100 return mandatory minimum (though I know 2011, it is 10 returns), so this year, I told all clients that paper filed about the mandatory and just handled them the efile forms to sign. Noone complained. They were excited not to have to mail anything. A couple of them owed, so I printed out the 1040-V for them to let them pay by check.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=MilTaxEA|Date=21 April 2011|Text=Cathy, did you know you can do an electronic funds withdrawal at any date up to the due date of the return if they owe money and e-file? My clients love to do that because they don't have to worry about mailing anything in. And it's free! Of course, I still have clients who rather sending in a check even after I explain the benefits of EFW.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Jeff-Ohio|Date=21 April 2011|Text=Not only that, but you can pay via credit card on the IRS website (and most states allow it also)}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Jeff-Ohio|Date=21 April 2011|Text=So, I've gathered some notes from here, from peers and tossed in a few of my own:

PROS:
• Getting all of our clients (personal and business) to e-file

UNFORESEEN CIRCUMSTANCES:
• Congress decided to wait until Dec 17th, 2010 to make changes that significantly impacted the entire filing season.
• We could not even start filing most of our returns until February 14th. .
• Lacerte had a significant number of issues (glitches)
• Many returned their tax documents later than in years past.
• We replaced a mid-level staff with a first-year (although very eager to learn and educated)
• Another mid-level staff moved to Florida – however, her work from home was successful, just a little delayed.
• Our experienced (50+ years) CPA first fell and broke his hip, then had to have his gall bladder removed – attempt at working from home was a semi-failure
• We have some staff that will do whatever it takes, others that will do whatever it takes and bitch and others that will leave at 5pm no matter what the case.

LESSONS LEARNED
• Quit making semi-promises after April 1 on when people can expect their return to be done.
• Get at least six hours of sleep most nights. In addition, when your body starts barking heed its call.
• Review, Review, Review, Question self, then Review again.
• Question clients thoroughly on unique items and those who have issues with your questions - run from.
• "Be a teacher...I cannot tell you how much good will we have created by not only telling our clients the tax law at it applies to their case but teaching it to them."
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CathysTaxes|Date=21 April 2011|Text=Yes, Michael, I did, but these clients were a little leery of efiling a return, so I told them they could mail their checks. Some of them believe this gives them more control. Some of my clients don't even keep a check register, so if I had it set up to do an auto pay from their account, they'd forget about it and not have sufficient funds.

Jeff, I have one client who always asked about info for paying with the credit card. Lacerte had an option on their client letters to include this info. And you are right after rushing to get returns in. I have one retired client who is a master at procrastinating. She called me before going on vacation in March and said she thinks she may have her stuff by April 1st. On Saturday, April 16th, at 6:30pm she leaves me a message that she wants to extend (I had already filed the extension).}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Jeff-Ohio|Date=21 April 2011|Text=Cathy - we use Lacerte - where would I find that option?

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=CathysTaxes|Date=21 April 2011|Text=Jeff, I haven't used Lacerte since 2007. But then, it was under Client Letter form 5.1, the sixth line down says "Credit card instructions 1=yes 2=no [O]}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Joan TB|Date=21 April 2011|Text=I use Lacerte, and Cathy is correct about the location of this checkbox. This adds a paragraph on your "filing instructions" page about what phone numbers the TP can call to arrange a credit card payment. However, before promoting this to clients, I would make sure about the service fee structure for these sorts of payments. I think they are quite hefty, and if they are, you would want to explain that very thoroughly to your clients.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=22 April 2011|Text=Same Every Year:
# perpetually improve efficiency of systems in biz.
# Identify new/more delegable items for me AND MORE IMPORTANTLY TOP STAFF ("Why is that $40/hr employee doing what a $12/hr ee can do?"). There's likely more leverage here than anyone can imagine profit-wise.
# Plan three ways simultaneously: SHORT-term (get out today's work profitably), MID-term (what am I doing in a systematic way, preferably delegated to someone else or outsourced, to generate new work in 3-6 months from now) and LONG-term (figure out how next tax season will be more profitable?). If I neglect any one of these in favor of another, my checkbook feels it sooner or later.
# BIGGEST of all, (part of mid- and long-term) quickly shift after tax season from attracting strangers as new clients to marketing additional more profitable services to existing clients BY FINDING OUT WHAT THEY WANT HELP WITH that they told me when I asked during tax interviews (Can you tell I hate mail-in/drop-off tax work?).
# BTW: Biz clients are willing to pay to be coached in the areas mentioned above. But only the smart ones. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=24 April 2011|Text=Mail in and drop off returns is the way to grow with the greatest profitab ility. We are now over 40 percent. }}

Discussion:First audit.

2011-04-23T15:30:01Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=LadyTax|Date=22 April 2011|Text=Hello. First time poster, long time lurker....I just learned a client of mine is being audited. This client has very good records so I am not very nervous but this is my first time and am asking you pros if I am being foolish not to be nervous. Would anyone like to offer advice on what to do or not to do? Thank you.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Flybynight|Date=22 April 2011|Text=I'd honestly just go to a CPE course or purchase a book on the subject. I know Amazon has a few "stand up to the IRS" books, although some of the advice is bad, but they provide a decent overview. Some of the practitioner's guides from West or Lexis are pretty good as well, but expensive.

If the client has good records, then I'm generally not nervous either, as documentation should carry the day. Still, it's good to read a book or two so that your client doesn't think ill of your expertise. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Death&Taxes|Date=22 April 2011|Text=If you can find this book, which now has 3-4 authors and goes for over $500, you solve all your problems.

http://www.ecampus.com/representing-audited-taxpayer-before-irs/bk/9780685319338

I think I still have the old Callaghan blue notebook from a gazillios years ago. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Flybynight|Date=22 April 2011|Text=That's a good recommendation. We have a copy of the 2010 edition in the office; it's currently published by Thomson Reuters/West.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=22 April 2011|Text=first of all, what is being audited?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=22 April 2011|Text=Tell your client that YOU are going and they are not.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=LJACPA|Date=23 April 2011|Text=This is one of my greatest concerns (fears???), one of my clients being audited. My concern is not my work (though I could have made an error, no doubt) or my client having to provide records (they're made well aware of their responsibility) but the cost of providing representation. I make absolutely certain that my engagement letters include a paragraph stating that should they be audited/examined that I would be available to represent them at a separate cost and separate engagement. What I believe is likely the case, most clients believe if you prepare the return you have to represent them and that there would be no additional cost. Representation could result in huge fees, good for me maybe impossible for them. That's my concern, when they balk at my sometimes-lower-than-HRB fees, what are they going to do when I bill an hourly rate, retainer required, that's above and beyond their tax prep fee?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=23 April 2011|Text=Ask for retainer up front. Good clients will pay you. No need to get nervous with good or bad records. It is the taxpayers problem. Its their tax liability. }}

Discussion:Filing a 706 when not required?

2011-04-23T15:14:27Z

DZCPA:

{{Basic Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Tailwind|Date=22 April 2011|Text=I am settling an estate that is below the limits for 2011 (1.6 million)

The attorney recommended filing the 706 form even though it's not required. A little digging and I found two other estates from the last two years that were significantly below the limits and filed the 706. What am I missing here? Reading the publications, it looks to be black and white.

What is your experience in this area?

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Dennis|Date=22 April 2011|Text=Current law differs from the law as it was several years ago. Filing the 706 is the only way to secure spousal portability.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tailwind|Date=22 April 2011|Text=Thanks Dennis.

In this case, wife passes away 2003, community property state with AB Trust. Husband now passes away in early 2011 with his portion of assets valued at 1.6. Wouldn't this scenario negate any spousal portability issues?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=KathiJud|Date=23 April 2011|Text=Doesn't filing the 706 start the click ticking on the statue of limitations?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tailwind|Date=23 April 2011|Text=I think it does start the clock, and that might be a good thing if you were close to the limits on your valuations. In this case, we are so far from the valuations I don't see the need. I will probably end up filing the form, but I am curious what the experience has been for the rest of you. Always file the 706, or only when required.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=23 April 2011|Text=Only file if close or required. Why waste the client$ money?}}

Discussion:Client copy - paper or email?

2011-01-17T16:29:25Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Xz|Date=15 January 2011|Text=Hi all:

I wonder if you are still giving clients paper copy of the tax return, or just email them the PDF file. Do clients prefer a paper copy or PDF copy?

I am think of emailing clients pdf file this year. Do you give clients a choice or just tell them they will receive a copy via email?

Thanks!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Belle|Date=January 15, 2011|Text=I always give my clients a choice. The younger ones like email/pdf; my 101 year-old client wouldn't have a clue if I offered a pdf to him.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tax Writer|Date=15 January 2011|Text=I agree with Belle. The younger clients prefer the PDF version, and the older ones want the paper return. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wahoo|Date=15 January 2011|Text=I am going to try and push the electronic version but this year (my first effort to push in this direct) I will probably ask clients what they prefer. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=15 January 2011|Text=I've given them a CD for the last 4 yrs. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fsteincpa|Date=15 January 2011|Text=I do hope that any email program you use is secure and keeps you in compliance. I do not believe you are allowed to email tax returns if there is no password protection.

That is why I use Client Portals. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Death&Taxes|Date=15 January 2011|Text=I give everyone a copy; since 85% are done by mail, I have to return their papers anyway. I use portals too and have had several people say they are satified with using the portal. Only one, however, doesn't get a copy and she is a Green Freak.

Curious: pdfs are fine for most returns, but when you get into multi-states, or 35-50 page returns, a pdf is almost frightening to open for a client. Our state copies are stapled separate from the Feds. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=JR1|Date=January 15, 2011|Text=98% get a pdf, and this year, it will be encrypted. And no, I don't ask!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Taxalmancer|Date=15 January 2011|Text=Most clients get a pdf in their portal, marked Draft Only, to review before I finalize. Every client gets a printed copy which is sent by mail or picked up. Nothing gets emailed. Call me crazy.

This year my software, ProSystem FX, has a feature where I can '''"Mask"''' the Client Copy. It puts an "***-**-****" in the social security fields. It also masks EINs and bank account numbers in the returns. I'll be using this with every return. Way to go CCH!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=NewYorkEA|Date=January 16, 2011|Text=I started out by providing both if they wanted the PDF on the CD-ROM. This year I will ask which one they want and will not provide the paper copy if they ask for a PDF. For those that do not ask for the PDF I will provide it anyway. Maybe they'll like it and ask for it next time. I will note that I provide PDFs with bookmarks that contain everything I normally include in the client copy. I am a firm believer that the final product given to the client needs to look professional- whether it is a hard copy or a digital one.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Umk395|Date=16 January 2011|Text=Most get a hard copy....some ask for a PDF (and I provide to them). Would like to move everyone towards PDF client copies only, but it adds one more step in the process. Am determining whether the cost of the paper (vs PDF) is more than the interruption (inefficiency) in the process of preparing/assembling the returns. What if you have an old email address? What if you mistakenly send the PDF to the wrong client? (Ann Anderson receive Alan Anderson's return in error! Ooops!). Adds one more possibility for staff error if you're preparing almost 1,000 returns a year.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=17 January 2011|Text=If you pdf return, will it include invoice, tax payment coupons and e file authorization forms to be returned to preparer?}}

Discussion:Tax organizer - paper or email? (Lacerte e-Organizer)

2011-01-16T02:57:11Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Xz|Date=15 January 2011|Text=Hi all,

I mailed some tax organizers to existing clients. It is pretty time consuming (and of course paper and postage too).

I wonder if any of you tried email the tax organizer to clients and if it worked well.

Thanks!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wahoo|Date=15 January 2011|Text=I did electronic organizers this year (although I sent a letter announcing it). It was still somewhat time consuming because I had to do a workaround since my software did not generate a saveable pdf. No real complaints so far other than a question from an 86 year old client (he did find me on the internet to begin with). I think I will get the same use as I would out of paper which it little to no use so I may consider dropping them altogether.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=15 January 2011|Text=Have used LAcerte's e-organizer for 4 yrs. Very Good. Saves us time. 2 Drawbacks: 1)Some clients must be banned from these since they plug in interest expense on their home into EVERY SINGLE "interest expense" input screen possible. Similar for every other category. Inefficient to find every error they've made. 2)some clients e-mail it back just before they leave the house, thus defeating the TREMENDOUS efficiency of our system of reviewing & identifying all loose ends prior to them coming in for their appointment (I WANT them to come in for face2face tax interviews). }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tax Writer|Date=15 January 2011|Text=I mentioned this in a prior thread, but I think that the paper-mailed organizers are better. I'm a big fan of technology, but the manila envelope with our office name (sitting next to the telephone) is a constant reminder to the client to make their tax appointment. I've also noticed that most clients stuff their tax docs into the envelope as they receive them. Our office encourages drop-offs, so the mailed organizers also become a way for the clients to drop off their paperwork to us in one packet. It works.

A few years ago, we tried Lacerte's e-organizer and it was a bust. Quite a few clients couldn't figure out how to use the e-organizer. The ones that did use it-- well, we couldn't trust their entries anyway.

Sometimes, I will e-mail a PDF organizer to a client who requests it. It doesn't happen very often-- about 5-10 times during the season.

Just my two cents. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=16 January 2011|Text=I agree.

}}

Discussion:Refund of 401k withholding for rollover

2010-12-16T20:38:21Z

DZCPA:

{{Consumer Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Candotax|Date=16 December 2010|Text=My friend passed away in 2010. Unfortunately the 401k administrator distributed the account to his widow by cutting a check and withholding 20%. She wanted to roll the entire 401k over into an IRA but the custodian won't oblige. She's still pursuing why this happened with the plan but who knows how long that will take.

Does anyone know how/if she can get the withholding refunded to her asap so that it can be rolled over w/in 60 days (or put into a Roth by 12/31/10)? The amount is too substantial to get from other sources as IRS publ 575 recommends.

Thanks!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Death&Taxes|Date=16 December 2010|Text=R2 has the same problem in a different context: [[Discussion: Rolling 401(k) Basis to a Roth IRA]]}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=16 December 2010|Text=When is the 60th day? In 2011?}}

Discussion Archives:Business expense is not deductible if not paid yet?

2010-12-16T16:54:59Z

DZCPA:

{{Consumer Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Jayhahncpa|Date=15 December 2010|Text=My client (calendar year corporation) is being audited by the IRS. Some business expenses claimed in 2008, but not paid yet due to slow business. The IRS agent said these expenses cannot deductible since payments are not made yet. Is it understandable? I am not sure... Also, this client purchased a fixed asset of around $150,000 in 2008 on installment plan, but not paid, either. I, of course, depreciate this asset on 2008 income tax return. If the IRS agent is right, I cannot duduct depreciation in 2008? Any comments will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 December 2010|Text=did they have any questions on the difference between a cash and accrual basis taxpayer when you took the CPA test? What are the rules for accruing expenses? As for the fixed asset, was a liability booked? Did the taxpayer actually owe it?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=15 December 2010|Text=Are debits always near the door?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 December 2010|Text=the adage is that they are always near the window, I believe. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=16 December 2010|Text=I might be doing it wrong. Time to turn my desk around. }}

Discussion Archives:Business expense is not deductible if not paid yet?

2010-12-15T22:06:36Z

DZCPA:

{{Basic Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Jayhahncpa|Date=15 December 2010|Text=My client (calendar year corporation) is being audited by the IRS. Some business expenses claimed in 2008, but not paid yet due to slow business. The IRS agent said these expenses cannot deductible since payments are not made yet. Is it understandable? I am not sure... Also, this client purchased a fixed asset of around $150,000 in 2008 on installment plan, but not paid, either. I, of course, depreciate this asset on 2008 income tax return. If the IRS agent is right, I cannot duduct depreciation in 2008? Any comments will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 December 2010|Text=did they have any questions on the difference between a cash and accrual basis taxpayer when you took the CPA test? What are the rules for accruing expenses? As for the fixed asset, was a liability booked? Did the taxpayer actually owe it?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=15 December 2010|Text=Are debits always near the door?}}

Discussion:First audit

2010-12-14T01:04:06Z

DZCPA:

{{Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Wildcat 24|Date=11 December 2010|Text=Had my first audit this past week - covering a sched C client that I prepared. It was at the IRS office and was more pleasant (if you can refer to an audit as pleasant) than I could have ever anticipated.

Two examiners were conducting the audit with me. (I immediately started to panic inside when they first told me both would be sitting in.) One was 6 months into the job and other was a 22 year veteran. Lots of small talk was made as I thought it would liven the mood. The most annoying aspect was sitting in front of them and waiting as the veteran would turn to her computer and log in information into the system. I was extremely prepared and tried to anticipate most questions. All evidence was prepared in folders by line items with summary reports on the front page. Receipts corresponded to tick marks on the summary page.

Although the IDR requested documentation for 3 specific line items, I prepared evidence for every single portion of the schedule C in neatly organized labeled folders. The audit lasted 4 hours mainly due to constant probing questions about my client’s business (and small talk). After covering every entry on the summary list for the first line item and going over corresponding receipts, I was surprised they weren’t interested in reviewing other line items in the same detail as we moved along.

All in all it was a much different experience than expected. Adjustments were minor and I’m expecting the proposed adjustments soon. Auditors were very friendly and courteous and client is very happy with the proposed results. As this was my first audit, I thought it would be a nightmare – especially at their office. No real basis for my expectation other than reading horror stories on TA.

Representation has been an area that has always interested me. The planning/organization stage and time spent with the client was enjoyable…as was the actual audit at their office (not to mention more lucrative than tax prep).

Is this typical? Or did I hit the audit rep lottery?
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=11 December 2010|Text=This was obviously a training session for the junior auditor. Your client lucked out.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=TOrahaCPA|Date=11 December 2010|Text=You had a tax examiner, opposed to a revenue agent ("RA"). Tax examiners audit simple returns. It's my understanding that before TE's didn't do Schedule C's. However, now they do. They look at common deductions. My professor said that although TE's don't audit complicated returns they know the rules surrounding schedule A deductions and claiming dependents very well. I had a TE office exam as my first and only audit. I was prepared and every line item was supported, so my audit went well, just like yours.

I believe that's how it is with TE's they are given exactly what to audit, and they only look at that. Whereas with RA's, who are more savy, they handle sophisticated taxpayers and have the discretion to expand audits into areas that they may feel are appropriate.

Just out of curiousity what line items did they audit?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wildcat 24|Date=11 December 2010|Text=Gross receipts, travel, meals & entertainment and car expenses. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DaveFogel|Date=11 December 2010|Text=This sounds like you were dealing with a trainee Revenue Agent and his/her OJI (On the Job Instructor). You should be commended for being well prepared because the favorable outcome was, no doubt, due to your advance preparation and anticipation of questions.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Southparkcpa|Date=11 December 2010|Text=How did they verify gross receipts?

I have been through at least 10 audits and only ONCE did the auditor examine the clients "other" or "personal" bank statements. i.e, all deposits to business account but the IRS on only ONE occasion examined my clients personal checking account to verify unknown deposits.

What was your experience here? }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=LJACPA|Date=12 December 2010|Text=Every time I read something like this it scares me silly. I know there will come a time when I am faced with the audit of a client for a tax return I prepared. I do not look forward to it in anyway (nor does anyone) but would make the same effort to be prepared ahead of time. That would be one issue but the issue that concerns me most is the fee to do so. You mention 'lucrative' in regards to this work, which apparently did not concern your client though this must have been very costly considering all the additional, unrequested work you did. I can think of several of my clients who would be prime candidates for audit and likely will be and can no more afford to pay those fees than I could afford to not bill them. I dread the time when this happens. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Wildcat 24|Date=12 December 2010|Text=Thanks Dave. I admit I over prepared as this was my first audit. I wanted to go the extra mile as to not look like a rookie. Although it was a first for me, it wasn't a complicated area where I thought I'd sink.

Southpark - car expenses were examined first. After examining the detail mileage log I had the client reconstruct (for 2008) and all gas, insurance etc, they didn't appear interested in examining every receipt for travel, M&E as it appeared they thought I was well organized. A few adjustments were noted but nothing major - we debated quite a bit over necessary & ordinary. When we moved on to the final category, gross receipts, I reached into my bag to pull out the folder which contained every bank statement for multiple accounts tied out to a summary sheet. They examined the name on the statements to verify they were the TP's...and that's it. The last thing I wanted to do was say "Wait...let's go through this to verify unknown deposits". I couldn't of tossed it any faster in my bag.

LJACPA - This is my 5th year preparing returns and every year the "is this the year" thought crosses my mind. I'm glad it came and went. I myself don't have wealthy clients, rather common folks like me. When I say lucrative, I speak relative to the prep fee I charged. In no way will I charge my client the full back end time I spent preparing since it was my first time. Even though I prepared a detailed client request list, my client preferred I sit with him in his office for 6 full hours preparing the back up with him (a painful process) - which I will definitely charge for and was agreed to beforehand in my engagement letter.

I explained to my client this is certainly something he can handle rather than racking up fees to me. I even offered to charge him a nominal fee to help him prepare his documents. He wanted nothing to do with facing the IRS at their office. That alone I feel is one of the main reasons...fear. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Smokeytax|Date=13 December 2010|Text=Wildcat 24 - way to go on getting through your first audit! The hours you "ate" preparing were definitely worth it.

Like you and LJACPA, in the past several years, I've been starting to dread the promised upcoming increase in audits. I've gone through under 10, mostly way back in the 1980's and 1990's.

Here's the strategy I've come up with in getting ready for increased audits:
- Take as many courses as I can on the subject.
- Develop relationships with local tax attorneys, which will be needed for a trip to Tax Court.
- Step up my communications with clients as to their record keeping requirements.
- Develop relationships with other tax practitioners. Experts say that dealing with the IRS can be as much an art as a science, so having others to bounce strategies off of is needed. There are some, mostly EA's, who specialize in tax audit representation and will take referrals and do the whole job on returns I've prepared if needed.

If we prepare tax returns, our clients expect us to be able to handle all their dealings with the IRS, either on our own or coordinating referring out the work if needed.

Have you come up with any other strategies for getting ready to handle more audits?
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tkelly911|Date=13 December 2010|Text=For non attorney practioners, I strongly recommend you familiarize yourself with two IRC sections. IRC § 7430, which concerns itself with the recovery of attorney fees and costs (for which you do not have to be an attorney) and IRC § 7491, which addresses how the burden of proof may be shifted to the IRS in litigation. Both statutes in practice require building an administrative record from the very beginning of an examination, in particular documenting your cooperation with the Service in providing requested information. Unfortunately, by the time I see cases for which a petition to the Court is appropriate, the administrative record is inadequate to support either a request for fees or the shifting of the burden of proof. Accomplishing either of these objectives is difficult because of the particular requirements of each, especially as set forth in the very detailed Treasury Regulations for the respective statutes. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Smokeytax|Date=13 December 2010|Text=That's a fantastic tip, Tkelly911. Thanks.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=14 December 2010|Text=

More info on Audits. From year 2007. Not much different now.

http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:How_Many_Audits_Did_You_Have_in_2007%3F}}

Discussion:Do you prepare you own Tax Return??

2010-12-07T16:06:51Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=7 December 2010|Text=Seems like a no brainer and simple enough question, but I am curious. I didn't find any topics in the yellow box, so I thought I would ask....The reason I ask is partially due to my background as a loan officer. I remember we had to get two years tax returns in order to include self employment income. I seem to remember needing Audited Financial Statements in some situations, but I can't remember what those were.

I am curious because if I go to say buy a house in 2012 (which I am planning to do by the way), and I want to include my self-employment income, will the lenders accept my tax returns if I have prepared them myself? Wouldn't they want to see some independent verification of my income?

I guess they could file the 4506 with the IRS and pull the return that was actually filed, but that does not rule out the possibility that a person filed a fraudulent tax return....just putting my skeptics hat on....anyone have experience with this??? Would they require audited financial statements in this case??}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=AEM CPA|Date=7 December 2010|Text=I doubt loan officers would think you would over-report your income to the IRS just to get a loan. Almost invariably, people who commit fraud under-report their income to the IRS, and inflate it on the financial statements. There's always the possibility that a return is fraudulent, but self-preparation, especially by a tax pro, can't be construed as evidence of fraud by a reasonable person. If they have a problem with it, just show them your backup - invoices, bank statements, etc. You won't have an issue.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=7 December 2010|Text=Your self prepared returns are fine for last 2 years. They will need a current financial statement for the short current period. I usually add a Schedule C with the top year crossed out and then note the period it is for. Telling them you are an accountant will also help. All banks have different rules. The above has worked for most lendors. }}

Discussion:Buying or Selling a Tax Practice

2010-12-03T22:17:05Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Umk395|Date=3 December 2010|Text=I'd like to learn more about the details of buying an accounting/tax practice. Here are a few questions I have:

1. What's the "going" rate for purchasing accounting/tax practices? It obviously depends on a lot of factors. Most accounting/tax practices I've seen lately are selling for 1.25-1.30 times revenues.

2. What's the "typical" way to structure the acquisition price? Obviously, no one will pay 100% cash upfront (unless the price is discounted). I'm seeing that more often than not, the deal is structured with 75% down, then 10%

3. For integration and continuity purposes, most accounting/tax practices announce the deal to their clients as a "merger" instead of "I"m selling my business to Joe Smith". This results in more clients staying on board instead of jumping ship (and adversely affecting the purchase price). Then, the "old" owner stays on board for at a minimum of a year so he can introduce his clients to the "new" owner.

4. Wondering what your thoughts are on selling the accounting/tax practice in May vs in Dec (right before tax season). I would prefer purchasing an accounting/tax practice in Dec. If purchased in May, and most of the revenues were tax-related, then you won't know for 7-10 months down the road whether you made a bad deal by giving the seller 75% of the purchase price upfront. Would rather know the answer to that question within 60 days by buying the business in Dec. So while it seems that most sellers want to punch out right after tax season (May), that's not the ideal time for a buyer to purchase the business if most of the revenues are tax-related.

5. I am seeing that a lot of accounting/tax practices that are for sale are over-staffed. I base my conclusion on knowing how many clients I have and what it takes in term of resources to process those clients. Could be that the other accounting/tax practices process their clients differently than me, etc -- plenty of reasons. This was just a general observation.

6. What are brokers charging for selling accounting/tax practices? I assume 10%-20%

7. When an accounting practice is sold, what percent of clients drop out and go somewhere else. Anyone have any first-hand or indirect knowledge of this?

Other thoughts/experiences?

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=3 December 2010|Text=I will call you to discuss. I have purchased 7 EA/CPA firms in last 22 years }}

Discussion:How much experience do you need to go off on your own.

2010-12-02T00:27:06Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=BJtheCPA|Date=30 November 2010|Text=I'm afraid that this forum has seen this exact question many times. However, I did use the search function for "experience, experience starting, how much experience, and starting", as well as a number of other search terms and didn't come up with any such discussions.

I apologize if I'm beating a dead horse. But I'm a fairly young CPA mid-late twenties, I've been out of school for three years. I started at a Big Ten firm and left after the first tax season as I quickly realized I was being pigeon-holed. I then spent about a year with a private manufacturing company as I couldn't find public work. Finally, I ended up where I am now, at a small CPA firm with two partners, two staff, some part-timers, and an office manager, I've been here for about a year and a half.

The firm is at a size that they don't want to grow anymore, and neither partner is retiring anytime soon, so there is not a lot of potential upside to me being here as I can't really take on my own clients and pursue partnership.

I don't want to go to work for someone else, I want to go out on my own, but I'm concerned about experience. I'd like to start off making at least a similar income to what I'm making now (low 40's), so I would guess purchasing my own firm would be the route to go. I've been frugal and have the financial assets to make a down payment on a purchase. I know that there is no "golden rule" as far as how much experience is needed, but are there "any" guidelines?

I've spoken with a broker who is also a CPA, and she's assured me that I have the skills to take on a practice that has mostly tax and book-keeping clients. She says I should buy this firm that's grossing between 250-300k, has two employees and some part-time help. However, I realize that's about as unbiased of an opinion I'd get as going to a car salesman and asking if they think you need a new car.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BJtheCPA|Date=30 November 2010|Text=I forgot to mention, my experience with the Big Ten firm was 100% audit, manufacturing company was controller type functions, and current job is 70% Tax (all types, 1120, 1040, 1041, 5500, 990, bookkeeping, and payroll) and 30% audit (50% NFP, 50% manufactoring).

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=30 November 2010|Text=You are ready! Go for it. You will continue to learn during the next 40 years. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=PHIL MOODY|Date=30 November 2010|Text=You do not say much about money, except the down payment. Just keep in mind:
Your health Insurance.
It may take 2-3 months to get the pump primed and the cash to start flowing in, rather than out.
Even then, you will have ups and down is cash flow time periods.
No matter which clients you purchase, you will lose some of them.
You need financing in either a line of credit (loc) at a bank, or a home equity loan for those periods of time when cash flow out exceeds cash in. Prepare cash flow analysis by week for a two year period.
Some of your time will be administrative for your firm, thus non-billable.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Trillium|Date=30 November 2010|Text=You're sure to get more posts on this topic, but if you're also interested in reading prior discussions, or even just learning more about the site's search engine, I would suggest this search: [http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php?ns0=1&ns2=1&ns3=1&ns4=1&ns8=1&ns10=1&ns12=1&ns14=1&ns110=1&ns112=1&ns114=1&ns118=1&redirs=1&search=%22starting+out%22+experience+%22business+growth%22&title=Special%3ASearch&fulltext=Advanced+search&fulltext=Advanced+search "starting out" experience "business growth"].

You searched on starting and experience, but those words can be found in so many contexts that you probably got a high percentage of results that weren't on point. "How much experience" was probably the most fruitful of the searches you mentioned trying (if the quotes were included), but "experience starting" on the other hand, would only have found those two words in that order, so I'm not surprised that didn't turn up anything. Here are some more [[Hints and Tips on How to Search on TaxAlmanac]], in case you're interested in more info.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=30 November 2010|Text=Many of us started with only one year of experience as an employee for another firm. I suppose some started on their own with only an H&R Block class. The keys are:

1) Don't be afraid to tell your client you don't know, but will find out. Then look it up.

2) Do invest in good quality CPE and a few research materials. The internet doesn't count.

3) Have plenty of money to live on for two or three years while you plow everything back into your practice.

4) Charge a professional fee. Don't try to be the cheapest on the block. You will not keep cheap clients once you raise your fees, so why attract them to begin with?

5) Ask for referrals.

6) Press the flesh. Don't rely on advertising, rely on marketing which includes YOU getting out there and shaking people's hands and handing them your card. Advertising is expensive and half of it doesn't work. The problem is that no one knows which half doesn't work.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Bbowers|Date=30 November 2010|Text=The timing is perfect if you can close before tax season. Take the time to lay out your cash flow using conservative numbers based on the practice history. If the numbers work I'd jump in. You'll never know everything you should so plan on lots of continuing education. Find a good mentor to help you as you get started. Good luck!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BJtheCPA|Date=30 November 2010|Text=A lot of thanks to the replies so far. It's very encouraging to have like-minded professionals reiterate what I've only thought up in my own head. I'm glad I've found this site.

To some points that have already been made:

1. ''You are ready! Go for it. You will continue to learn during the next 40 years.''

I noticed in a lot of other messages that your a huge advocate of purchasing firms to start out. Is there a certain size you would be hesitant to go after when just starting out? (i.e. too small to make any $ or too large to reasonably manage without experience)

2. '' You do not say much about money, except the down payment. Just keep in mind... Prepare cash flow analysis by week for a two year period. Some of your time will be administrative for your firm, thus non-billable.''

This is top-notch advice and I really appreciate it, I will definitely build that into my business plan. I'm not comfortable giving out specific #'s of what I can and can't do right now, but for ball park figures let's say I have access to $50,000 in cash, home equity, and other assets.

3. ''...but if you're also interested in reading prior discussions, or even just learning more about the site's search engine, I would suggest this search: "starting out" experience "business growth".''

Thanks for the search hints, this site is awesome and the tips will come in handy!

4. ''Many of us started with only one year of experience as an employee for another firm. I suppose some started on their own with only an H&R Block class. The keys are...''

Great points and definitely are in line with the business structure I will be leading. A lot of the reason I'm not happy where I am right now is I've had three clients approach me who were needing reviews or audits done (about $15-20,000 combined in projects), and my employers said we don't have the time to do the work.

I have the ability and ambition to do the networking (I already am active in my church, the state society association, my fraternity alumni association, and volunteer in my community), but if I can't take clients from it, it's just a waste. (Of potential, not time as I do enjoy doing those things)

5. ''The timing is perfect if you can close before tax season.''

This is a little difficult for me to do, I suppose I should pull up my training pants and be a man about it, but I really don't feel like leaving before crunch time is an appropriate way to treat my current employers.

They do not know that I'm considering purchasing my own firm (even though in the interview process I let it be known that I'm aspiring to become a partner). I do not want to leave them out to dry for busy season. If I do end up purchasing a firm, it will probably be in the October-November time frame and I will let my current employers know a bit before.

Sorry for being long-winded but I like to cover all bases. Thanks again for replies and I look forward to more.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=30 November 2010|Text=There have been several discussions here on TA regarding doing attest work. The concensus seems to be to make sure you have adequate E&O coverage and make sure that you charge enough and do enough to cover the mandatory peer review (or other state requirements). Good luck.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tax Writer|Date=30 November 2010|Text=I agree with all of Kevin's advice, especially about the E&O if you are going to do attest work. You can charge a nice premium for those services, but CYA, CYA!

It sounds like you are pretty well connected already--it doesn't sound like you need to purchase a practice. An EA friend of mine just struck out on his own last year and had 150 clients the first year--more than enough to keep afloat and pay the bills, and of course, now he's expanded considerably into his second year. Remember that you can purchase a practice at any time. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Ukbones|Date=30 November 2010|Text=What do you want out of your practice? What will be your area of expertise? }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Death&Taxes|Date=30 November 2010|Text=An angel helps; I was fortunate enough to have a client lend me money, and at a rate 2-3% over market but with a five year term. My associate/partner and I began in late May so that money carried us until the next busy season. It enabled us to buy a group health policy, hire our office manager 2-3 months in advance, and attend auctions where we bought office furnishings.

In addition, it helped to have a credit card, two or three. When time came to get equipment, I found the interest rates when leasing to be non-competitive so we used plastic (just before busy season) and paid it off in six months.....which begat more offers of plastic....}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BJtheCPA|Date=30 November 2010|Text=I have a large network, but not a lot of leads on actual work yet. I do believe I could "make" it work but I'm just not comfortable with going from zero revenue to hoping that I have "some" revenue before my reserves are depleted. So I guess I'm essentially purchasing cash-flow when purchasing a firm.

''What do you want out of your practice? What will be your area of expertise?''

I'm hoping to focus on small business clients. Namely professionals such as doctors/dentists, pharmacists, lawyers, and veterinarians. I will offer tax, book-keeping, payroll, compilation, review, and business valuation services. (I'm currently working on my CVA) Obviously, the tax, book-keeping, and payroll areas are segues into the higher hourly jobs such as the valuation services.

I have many connections in both the medical and law industries around my city, as I have a surprisingly large group of friends that have attended the local medical and law schools. I will distinguish my firm as a professional tax consulting firm, rather than a tax shop. I'm planning on this distinction to allow me to charge a reasonable hourly rate that the clientele expects to be paying for the level of service I deliver.

I may eventually offer audits, it depends on the size of the firm and how much of the market I feel that I can capture or am comfortable with.

Obviously if the strategy that "works", isn't the one I "planned", I will adjust accordingly. This also limits my options on purchasing a firm as I have a pretty specific niche I want to build into. That being said, there is no reason I can't buy a firm with a "good" client base and turn it into a "great" client base of my own, as the difference in the two is largely perception.

''An angel helps''

Depending on the size of the firm, I may have my parents sign onto a loan with me or loan me the money personally, as they have a good amount of liquid backing. Obviously, that will be one of the last options that I will exhaust.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Waynecpa|Date=30 November 2010|Text=As to your question on whether the $250-$300k practice with 2+ employees, I feel that I can speak to that since that is exactly what I did 5 years ago. My only regret is that I didn't have a little more due diligence with the employees. I asked the person I bought the practice from what the employees' strengths and weaknesses were and she said she couldn't think of any weaknesses. This should have been a little bit of a red flag - about 4 months after I took over one employee left and she ended up contacting some of my clients to solicit their business. It took me another year to fire an employee who I felt was just putting in time for a paycheck.

Lesson learned - Be sure you are ready to deal with employees if you go into this situation and make sure you are working toward the same goal. Your employees need to have your back and at this size of practice, they frequently are the first impression a new client may get of your practice.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=AEM CPA|Date=30 November 2010|Text=Which Big Ten firm did you work for? I'm a Penn State fan myself. Don't say Ohio State. I'll never get over the horrendous injustice that JoePa's boys suffered in 1994 when they were ranked #1 going into the Ohio State game, obliterated them 63-14, and yet somehow dropped to #2 in the polls the next week. Unbeaten, untied, unrewarded. Absolute travesty.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BJtheCPA|Date=30 November 2010|Text=Hah, yeah the firm liked to refer to itself as a "Big Ten" firm since they claimed the Big Four didn't exist anymore after all the scandals and melt-downs. It was probably more wishful thinking of brand image and notoriety than anything else, but yeah, they were one of the ten largest in the country and they loved referring to themselves as such, for whatever that's worth.

I'm a huge Ohio State anti-fan. Way over-rated most years.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=AEM CPA|Date=30 November 2010|Text=To mix sports, then, they were in the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1967_NHL_expansion Second Six].}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Xz|Date=1 December 2010|Text=Yes. You have enough experience to work on your own. You will learn a lot as you go. Now you roughly know how a CPA firm works. The key is to research and keep learning.

I have been in business for a year - not even full time since I have a school-age daughter - I do work and think a lot whenever I can. I made a small profit, moved to a bigger office and expect my gross income to double next year. (My family does not rely on my income).

You have the urge to work on your own and the ambition, go for it! We invest too much time and money on schooling. Why don't we invest some time and money on becoming our own boss? Your world is as big as you can dream of.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Fletch|Date=1 December 2010|Text=go ahead and fill out your profile. Just cut and paste from this thread}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Waynecpa|Date=1 December 2010|Text=BJ - Check your user page for a message.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Thomascpa|Date=December 1, 2010|Text=I just wanted to wish you the best of luck. I wish I could offer up some advice but I am actually in a very similar boat as you. I am in my late 20's and started out at a Big 4 after college for about 5.5 years, then left to go to a private company tax department (currently here for a little over a year). My partner and I had been doing 1040's and small business tax and accounting on the side for a few years now and will bring in a shade below $20K in revenues for 2010. We just recently formed a CPA firm under a PLLC in NY.

We have found through the advice of many well respected opinions that the best way for us to go is to find a practice that fits our needs (pretty much same client mix you are looking for) and buy one. Since there are two of us we are looking in the $500-600K range. The hardest part is waiting for one in our area to become available.

It is nice to see other young professionals such as yourself realize that you want more out of your career and be willing to take a risk and do what's necessary to accomplish all of your life goals. Nowadays it seems as if the majority just look for a free ride or the easy way out. I have already taken some good knowledge out of this thread and I hope the useful info from those who are more experienced keep coming.

Good luck to you!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=2 December 2010|Text=Buying firms is a great way to grow. Just purchased my 7th last month. Preparers are getting older and retiring. Keep your eyes and ears open for sales. They go fast! Clue: the selling preparers look old!!!}}

Discussion:Electronic Signatures - Cool new solution

2010-12-02T00:18:18Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=22 November 2010|Text=Ok, so for those of us who transact most of our business online, this has to be the next killer ap....I came across this while I was browsing for something else....its called Rightsignature.com [https://rightsignature.com/], and for those of us trying to figure out how to get signed Forms <s>8867</s> 8879 back quickly without too much hassle to the client, this MIGHT be an excellent solution.

So the way it works is if you have a document you need a client to sign, you go into this application and load the document. You place a signature field wherever it needs to go in the document. Once completed you send the document to your client through Rightsignature.com. Your client receives the document, and can sign the document one of three ways:

1. Use your mouse like a pen. While holding down the right mouse button, move the mouse in such a fashion as to sign your name.

2. Use your iphone/Blackberry with touchscreen to sign your document.

3. Fax a signature page to yourself and sign the signature page. Fax the signature page back to Rightsignature.com. The signature is then loaded into the document.

No.3 is a bit redundant since you could have faxed them the document in the first place. The upside though is that the client can save their signature for future use, so if they are a returning client, conceivably they only actually have to set this up once. After that it is a click of a button.

It's not exactly free, but it may be worth the expense ($132/year ($11/month) for the most basic plan paid on an annual basis, $14/month[$168] for monthly billing).

I tend to be such a sucker for cool technology myself that is until it comes time to pay up. I can see this one being a definite winner though. Any thoughts?? Would we even be able to use this??}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Natalie|Date=November 23, 2010|Text=Are the communications encrypted?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=23 November 2010|Text=Just have the clients mail it back after they look over return with a check for your fee. They need to send $$ back to you anyway? Save yourself $132 and a major headache when over 75% of your clients do not have a Blackberry/I Phone (with touchscreen) and refuse to send their signature over the internet. Who comes up with this trash??}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Rally180|Date=23 November 2010|Text=I do not think I have had anyone sign the EIC checklist.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kathyt|Date=23 November 2010|Text=For long distance clients I just email the return with two attachments, one is the client copy of the return and the other is the 8879, I tell them to look over the return, then print the 2nd attachment (8879) and mail it back to me with payment for the fee. I email it encrypted with a password. This method works well for me and my clients are happy with it.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=23 November 2010|Text=Rally - its a new due diligence measure I was thinking of implementing....should be Form 8879, thank you.

Natalie - Yes, communications are encrypted...

DZCPA - I would give that mindset about 5 to 10 years at the most....depends on who your clients are....with the stuff people put on facebook these days sending a signed document through encrypted communication is the least of their worries....If you are invoicing people via Paypal or something similar then there is no need for them to mail anything if they can sign electronically....

Also, you don't need to have an iPhone or Blackberry, but those would make it a bit easier. You can actually sign on your screen using your mouse....try it on the site they have demos....kind of weird at first, but after a few tries I was able to get mine to look about 95% like my actual handwritten signature.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=24 November 2010|Text=Make it simple for your clients and you will get and retain clients. This is very complicated. We keep things simple and have tons of clients. Good luck with round 2.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tax Writer|Date=24 November 2010|Text=I don't really see the point of this service? I just use Adobe Acrobat to sign my PDF docs (the signature looks like a wet signature). Then the clients just sign and fax it back to me (which goes right to my online fax account). So either way I don't need to use any paper. This seems more confusing.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=24 November 2010|Text=I was thinking more from the perspective of the client who does not have a fax machine or scanner. Now they don't need to print, sign, and then mail or get to a fax or scanner to send the signed document back to you.

You guys are probably right though. If you don't see the point I can only imagine the confusion for the client. Most people are probably just not ready for this. DZCPA you are absolutely right. Keep it simple stupid (KISS). I am probably too much of a techy though because this seems simple to me. If I don't have a fax or scanner and I want to get this process taken care of so my return can get filed, it makes it simple for me to be able to sign right on the spot and be done with it.

I have to constantly remind myself though that what may seem simple to me is not always simple to someone else who prefers to do something in a different way.

Oh, duhhh....I just realized what you meant by "good luck with Round 2". I need to update my profile. Thank You. Actually I passed part 2 in October and I passed part 3 two weeks ago. IRS cashed my Form 23 check 2 days ago, so I am waiting to get that enrollment card!!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=TaxKeeper|Date=24 November 2010|Text=BT,

Have been using DocuSign since my last Realtor sent all of our docs via this method and saved us countless hours in driving to RO Offices and Title Companies. I figured it could also work for my mail in clients. DocuSign works quite well and clients love it, but it only gives the option of the client typing in their "signature". The signatures are all legally binding and archived, and it gives my company the appearance of a technological advantage, which is a plus for my target client base.

I like the idea that the client can also use their mouse to create a closer resemblance to actual signature, so I might give RightSignature a try.
That it is slightly less expensive is also a bonus. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=24 November 2010|Text=TK,

Thanks for another perspective. The perception really will be based on the perspective of your client base. Something to consider.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=TERRYT|Date=24 November 2010|Text=It appears that whether the signature is "typed" or completed using a mouse, it would be near impossible to ever prove who signed the document. It could put the preparer right in the middle of a big problem financially, or even a criminal matter.

Even with manual signatures, sometimes spouses say their signature was forged, and they never saw the returns. A good divorce brings all of this out.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=TaxKeeper|Date=25 November 2010|Text=So an eSignature neither solves, nor exacerbates, your example Terry. People will still be able to do bad things to others.

People pay me to make their tax compliance obligations less of a hassle for them, and this is just one component of that service.

''"What are the legal requirements of electronic signatures?

(a) The signature must be unique to the person using it.

Electronic signatures meet this requirement by prompting individuals to perform an action that is unique to them, such as entering a private password each time that they electronically sign a document. Requiring the individual to enter information, such as a password, that is only known by him or her increases the reliability that the individual consented to certain policy provisions. This is accomplished via your e-mail address. Your e-mail address is unique, but it is not only known to you. '''However, your password to receive your e-mail is unique and known only to you. Requiring you to acknowledge your signature through an e-mail that only you can access satisfies this requirement.'''

(b) The signature must be verifiable.

Electronic signatures meet this requirement by associating a person's private password in a secure manner to the information they provided for identification. The electronic signature is then verifiable as coming from the person who electronically signed the document. This is again accomplished via your e-mail account and the process to sign the document.

(c) The signature must be under the sole control of the person using it.

Electronic signatures meet this requirement in two ways. First, before a person may electronically sign a document, he or she must enter something that is known only by that individual, such as a private password. Second, the individual also has control over the computer file which contains the application, including the electronic signatures. Again, your electronic signature satisfies this requirement because the document is not signed until you acknowledge your intent via an e-mail you receive that only you have access to receive.

(d) The electronic signature process must guarantee that the document signed cannot be altered after it has been electronically signed.

Once the document is electronically signed, it is secured by an electronic tamper-seal. This electronic tamper-seal will detect any changes to the document, and if any changes occur after the document was electronically signed, the electronic tamper-seal will invalidate the electronic signature. The electronic tamper-seal is completely secure and cannot be modified or removed without invalidating the electronic signature and the document. This process ensures that once the document is electronically signed, the contents of that document will remain unaltered. This is accomplished by locking the document once both parties have signed. No further changes to the document can be made.

(e) The electronic signature must capture and preserve the signer's intent, consent, understanding, or responsibility related to a document that is being signed.

The entire process to electronically sign the document accomplished this requirement. In order to sign the document, you must acknowledge your intent to sign by entering your name and initials. You further consent to the the understanding of your intent when you acknowledge your intent to sign the document by completing the signature process once you receive the confirmation e-mail."''}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Natalie|Date=November 25, 2010|Text="''it would be near impossible to ever prove who signed the document.''" I've said many times that if someone ever showed me a merchant receipt that I signed with one of those fancy electronic machines, I would likely deny that it is actually mine because it has very little resemblance to any paper I sign.

TaxKeeper, where did you get those rules from? }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=TaxKeeper|Date=30 November 2010|Text=Natalie,

The rules are from the Act passed in 2000.

The interpretation appears to be from a vendor.

This should go without saying, but in case it does not:
This is not a complete list of all the electronic signatures act requires/allows.

TK}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Nancy Jo|Date=1 December 2010|Text=BT: This is great information and will be a huge help to my clients who hate printing and faxing ANYTHING! Thanks for passing along.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=BTax2010|Date=1 December 2010|Text=Nancy Jo...Excellent!! Glad I could help. I am definitely keeping this one on my radar. I am just starting out, but if I get a good bit of business I can see this being helpful for me as well.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=2 December 2010|Text=Gear Up has a seminar on Technology which goes over most of the bells and whistles possible for a firm. You may find it helpful. }}

Discussion:How much experience do you need to go off on your own.

2010-11-30T15:27:34Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Give away free ipad

2010-11-28T06:11:10Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Mdavis|Date=26 November 2010|Text=I was thinking of doing a marketing ploy this year by giving away a free iPad, every client would be entered into it as long as we done there taxes and give it away at end of tax season, have any of you guys tried something like this?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Szptax|Date=26 November 2010|Text=I've never done anything like that and I wouldn't. I think people should come to you for your skills & expertise, not the chance of a give-away.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Grammarpolice|Date=26 November 2010|Text=Ploy? I think you've selected a word that doesn't convey honest intent. According to the Merriam Webster Dictionary:

Definition of PLOY
1
: escapade, frolic
2
a : a tactic intended to embarrass or frustrate an opponent b : a devised or contrived mov}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=26 November 2010|Text=I'd suggest using the correct grammar and proper English words also

'as long as we done there taxes' sic}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Szptax|Date=26 November 2010|Text=Also - check your local/state rules for raffles of any kind. In certain areas around here a "one time" license must be obtained. That alone can cost $100.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=26 November 2010|Text="Now for every referral I give you, my chances of winning go down. And for every referral that my referral gives you, my chances go down exponentially, so how many referrals will I send?"}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Death&Taxes|Date=27 November 2010|Text=If I ever thought of giving away a door prize, I would try to weight the entries based on loyalty....up to five years, one ticket goes into the hat, two tickets for up to ten year, and three tickets for greater. I can see it now: "Dish Night at Death & Taxes."}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=27 November 2010|Text=Doing this will make you appear unprofessional. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=27 November 2010|Text=um, did you read his profile, DZ? He's not looking for a 'professional' look, he's looking for a 'retail' look.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Taocpa|Date=27 November 2010|Text=Sure, go ahead and do it. It will just attract the bottom feeders.

Tom}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Rally180|Date=27 November 2010|Text=Matt, based on your business model, I think it is a good idea. You are not a brass & glass CPA firm and you are not working out of your house so, you need to market yourself to your desired client.

I would think JH has some sort of way to network with other owners to discuss what ways of marketing worked for them.

Give away a car. You can find lots of used Lincoln Town Car's used for under $5000. Park it outside with magnets on it telling people that you are drawing on Feb 15th. How many returns do you have to do to cover $5000? Tell them they get an extra chance for every referral.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Rally180|Date=27 November 2010|Text=Tom, the "bottom feeders" as you call them will put over $100,000 cash in my pocket by the middle of February. It may not be a client you want but, it is a market.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=27 November 2010|Text=How about Dunk the IRS Agent Tank set up in front of the shop. If you hit the IRS Agent in the nose with a ball, he falls into the container of water and your earn a 10% off coupon for a tax return preparation.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=27 November 2010|Text=Rally, 2000 returns X $50 each by mid February is amazing. Nice!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=NMexEA|Date=27 November 2010|Text=Yup, it's a raffle and probably illegal in most places. You could defeat the gambling nature of the device by allowing everyone who enters an equal chance to win regardless of whether they hire you to do their returns or not.

Somehow, I doubt that this is what you had in mind.

Raffles in general are permitted for charitable fundraising only. What you could do is sponsor the I Pad raffle with proceeds to benefit the local Red Cross or something like that. Might be a good publicity stunt.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Belle|Date=November 27, 2010|Text=DZ - LOL (for both recent answers)}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Rally180|Date=28 November 2010|Text=DZCPA, I do not understand what you are talking about. 2000 returns X $50? }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=28 November 2010|Text=Your website advertisment. Your coupon must be bringing the "bottom feeders" in by the boat load.
http://www.taxplacemain.com/special.html}}

Discussion:Client Referral Discount

2010-11-28T00:55:14Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=ETax847|Date=27 November 2010|Text=If a client, refers me another client, what is an appropriate discount to give him for the referral? I am asking as to give some incentive for others to make referrals as well. This is my second year in business and I want to create a sound incentive program from the start}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Taxaway|Date=28 November 2010|Text=The best way to get referrals: being accurate, knowledgeable and personable in your tax preparation. Clients will want to do their friends a favor by referring you.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=28 November 2010|Text=I would give ZERO discount for a referral. Just good service.}}

Discussion:Give away free ipad

2010-11-27T22:49:01Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Give away free ipad

2010-11-27T22:43:57Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Give away free ipad

2010-11-27T05:08:13Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Gifts on behalf of spouse after she dies

2010-11-27T05:02:54Z

DZCPA:

{{Advanced Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Orpheus|Date=27 November 2010|Text=My client's wife died earlier in 2010 and said that his estate tax attorney had told him that as he is filing a joint income tax return for 2010, he can gift $26,000 to his son ($13K from him and $13K from his deceased wife)before the end of this year, 2010. However, there is no joint gift tax return as there is for the income tax return and each party must file his/her own gift return, (or one form if it is gift-splitting). She did not make the gift before she died, so clearly she can not sign the gift tax return.

Before I say it can't be done, I just want to make sure there is not a provision whereby he can make a post mortem gift on her behalf (and sign for her as executor). Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=27 November 2010|Text=You gift son $1,000,000 before paying any tax. }}

Discussion:Estate tax practice

2010-11-24T21:47:57Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Bryancpa|Date=24 November 2010|Text=I would like to eventually develop my practice around estate, gift, and trust taxation. Does anyone in this arena have advice about how to "break into" this area? I have almost completed my Masters in Taxation (have focused on estate and trust classes), but should I be pursuing any law classes / degree? Is most of this work done through the offices of tax attorneys? What role do CPAs generally have if they want to practice in this area?

Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks! Bryan}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=24 November 2010|Text=Seminars at senior centers.}}

Discussion:Electronic Signatures - Cool new solution

2010-11-24T03:02:18Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Married - NOT!

2010-11-23T05:01:36Z

DZCPA:

{{Basic Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Waynecpa|Date=15 January 2009|Text=New clients have been married for 11 years, had kids, bought a house, wife changed name with SSA, but last week they found out that the minister was on the Most Wanted list and was not authorized to perform a marriage ceremony. Their lawyer says they were not legally married for the 11 years and the wife needs to change her name back. Since this isn't a common law marriage state, would the clients have to amend returns to head of household and single for open years?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 January 2009|Text=don't forget all of those charitable contributions to their minister's 'church'}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Trillium|Date=15 January 2009|Text=Seems like we had a similar discussion here in the past, and a key point was that if they got a license and it was registered approriately, the new-found status of the minister may not be the problem you'd think. But, this one is the closest I can find to that: [[Discussion:Thought_they_were_married%21%21|Thought they were married]], and that's not in there. Maybe it'll help you anyway.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=JR1|Date=January 15, 2009|Text=Yeah, puhleeze. These things have happened before, but I don't recall it ever nullifying a marriage. Get real. Let's say their attorney is correct. Eleven years. All those marriages, now void. That's a lot of amended returns. Worse, let's talk about estates, ownership of real estate, life insurance, health insurance...and unwinding ALL transactions.

Get the point? Her attorney is a goof.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Solomon|Date=15 January 2009|Text="''Her attorney is a goof. ''" - and ambulance chaser.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=15 January 2009|Text=at least we know he is not a divorce lawyer. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Laticiaw|Date=15 January 2009|Text=Wouldn't lay any bets on that one Kevin
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Death&Taxes|Date=15 January 2009|Text=The lawyer is angling to write a pre-nup.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Laticiaw|Date=15 January 2009|Text=Read the other discussion posted by Trillium and have to say that at some points I was laughing pretty hard...but most people do not check that information...also I didn't realize that common law marraige was not recognized in my home state...interesting.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Riley2|Date=15 January 2009|Text=This is a matter of state law. If this were a California couple, amended returns would probably be indicated.

However, in this case, there may be no need to file amended returns.

There was a recent Tax Court Summary Opinion indicating that Washington state law may allow for marital status if two co-habitating individuals hold themselves out as a married couple. See Eng G. Kang, et al. v. Commissioner, TC Summary Opinion 2001-97.
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=IDrinkYourMilkshake|Date=15 January 2009|Text=Riley, it is a matter of state law. However, didn't the state recognize the marriage during those years? If it did become void, I would think that would only come into play in the current year. Also, I agree, the lawyer seems.... well... inexperienced.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=IDrinkYourMilkshake|Date=15 January 2009|Text=Riley, it is a matter of state law. However, didn't the state recognize the marriage during those years? If it did become void, I would think that would only come into play in the current year. Also, I agree, the lawyer seems.... well... inexperienced.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=NMexEA|Date=16 January 2009|Text=IDrink,

Just off the cuff, I kinda think that you are right. I'd have to research it (which I won't, having more pressing stuff to do) but I think that everyone is pretty well "estopped" from questioning the validity of the "marriage" having relied upon it until now.

Something a little like this happened on a truly grand scale right after the Civil War. "Reconstructed" states like Texas followed the federal line and repudiated, declared void, all legislative, judicial, executive, and administrative acts of their governments taken by state officials during the Rebellion. (It was Pres. Lincoln's theory that secession was completely imposssible so all the state offices became vacant as a matter of law.)

But what about all those marriages and divorces through four long years of war? Not to mention all of the other routine civil lawsuits. You can't really "unwind" affairs like that. So as a practical matter, every act that was "complete" was left alone.

Now a question for the tax experts...wouldn't the usual three years statute of limitations apply to all those tax returns?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=AEM CPA|Date=16 January 2009|Text=I would think that, regardless of whether the minister had the authority to conduct a marriage ceremony, the State's issuance of a certificate of marriage would be sufficient. The couple had their marriage ceremony conducted in good faith (faith in what, I don't know - get married in the church and this isn't an issue), and the State issued a certificate by its own authority. I don't see the problem.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Riley2|Date=16 January 2009|Text=I gave the answer for a resident of Washington; however, in other states, it would be proper to file amended returns if the person conducting the ceremony had no authority to solemnize the marriage. See SCA 200202001.

For example, a marriage ceremony conducted in California by a phony minister results in an invalid marriage.
}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Waynecpa|Date=16 January 2009|Text=Update - now it appears that the wife doesn't really want to be married. She says that her husband has a business and has been taking care of the taxes on his own. An accountant in town has filed extensions the last three years but hasn't completed the returns. It seems she wants to file on her own but I'm not sure she has income. We'll see if she makes an appointment.

Also, in a Washington case, Weatherall v. Weatherall, the court held that a marriage which had been performed by an Indian chief who believed himself to have the authority to perform marriages was not void. In reaching this conclusion the court, basically, manifested an attitude of attaching considerably more importance to the legal capacity and intent to enter into a marriage contract on the part of the man and woman involved than to the formalities of the marriage ceremony including the identity or status of the person solemnizing the marriage.

Just as an interesting side note, I just finished reading the book "1635: The Dreeson Incident" by Eric Flint. This book was set in Germany in the 1600s and supposedly the vows between two individuals resulted in a legal marriage that was later formalized by a church wedding...}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Mscash|Date=16 January 2009|Text=There minister probably had an ordination by mail from the Universal Life Church. Here in California Quakers can be married following their own rules which are an exchange of vows between the couple in front of witnesses. If you are going to let Quakers do it, why discriminate against others. From a practical point of view what is the difference between an officiant asking the couple "Do you take this man/woman...?" and the couple saying "I take you..."

My even money bet is on there being a valid marriage and if I was their attorney I would recommend a valid dissolution or annulment if for no other reason to make sure nothing came back to bite them later. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Riley2|Date=16 January 2009|Text=Washington follows a "public policy" doctrine.

Quoting from the Kang decision, "Under Washington law, the burden of proof is upon the party alleging the existence of a marriage. In this case, the burden falls on respondent. On the other hand, there is such a strong public policy in favor of marriage that the law seizes upon all presumptions in order to repel the conclusion of unmarried cohabitation. See Thomas v. Thomas, 53 Wash. 297, 101 P. 865 (1909); Goldwater v. Burnside, 22 Wash. 215, 219, 60 P. 490 (1900). Such presumptions of marriage may be overcome only by the weight of clear, cogent, and convincing evidence. 5 See In re Sloan's Estate, 50 Wash. 86, 88-89, 96 P. 684 (1908." }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Riley2|Date=17 January 2009|Text=Mcash, in California, members of a religious sect that has no clergy are exempt from the solemnization requirement. California Family Code Sec. 307. However, be assured that the rest of us, in order to have a valid marriage, must comply with the solemnization requirement.

Yes, Quakers, having no clergy, are exempt from the solemnization requirement.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Waynecpa|Date=22 November 2010|Text=Update: I did some returns (MFS) for this client and the IRS kept her refunds to apply to past MFJ returns. We also filed a request for Innocent Spouse relief for her. There are many issues between her husband and the IRS and I believe CID has an active case with him. The wife has filed a "Declaration of Validity" for the marriage to be considered invalid. The court said it has jurisdiction to enter a declaration of invalidity and did so.

The IRS has denied her innocent spouse relief and we intend to appeal this judgment.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=23 November 2010|Text=Would I be considered a Virgin if I find out 20 years later that my ex wife was a Man??}}

Discussion:Electronic Signatures - Cool new solution

2010-11-23T04:56:42Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Cooperation with successor accountant

2010-11-22T23:20:08Z

DZCPA:

{{Basic Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Ramcfo|Date=22 November 2010|Text=I picked up a new S-Corp client recently with about 40 shareholders and a depreciation schedule from hell. I asked the predecessor accountant if they would provide me with the Lacerte data file for the client to make the transition easy. The answer unfortunately was "I don't have to give you that". This accountant cost the client dearly in mistakes made on the 401K calculations over the last few years resulting in necessary amendments and 30M-40M of outlay by the client. I calcuated nearly 100M of potential R&D credits not taken the last 3 years. We're still trying to figure out what to do about that. Potential liability is huge, and this accountant is playing hard to get. I don't get it. Just venting...}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Dblchai|Date=22 November 2010|Text=I get your frustration. You would think that the fear of law suit and mitigating damages would have the predecessor eager to cooperate.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=22 November 2010|Text=He does not want to give it to you. Some preparers are like that. Be happy you got a new client and stop worrying about making the transaction easy. Lazy tax preparers will not last in our business.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Dblchai|Date=22 November 2010|Text=I don't see it as lazy. Trying to ease the transition of a client is laudable. I generally try not to charge for transition time (I think it is unfair to cost a client $$ just to move their business to me). In this situation it looks like you're helping them out and therefore warranted in charging for transition time. Again, trying to mitigate that time by getting tools to help you be more efficient... Laudable.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Jimmer|Date=22 November 2010|Text=I've never requested a data file, and I doubt I'd provide one if asked. Sure it'd be nice to have, but you did just take his client, regardless of his competency.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Dblchai|Date=22 November 2010|Text=True. Now that you mention it, I'm not sure how I would feel about coughing up a data file.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Dblchai|Date=22 November 2010|Text=Then again, it didn't cost anything to ask! I know of an attorney who inherited about 12 related trust returns due to the prior accountant incompentence. He asked for the Lacerte files and the predecessor said yes. Can't hurt to ask.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=22 November 2010|Text=I will try and ask. If I do not get it. I move on and not complain.}}

Discussion:What are you using for a scanner?

2010-11-22T23:17:52Z

DZCPA:

{{Business Growth Community}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=AccIntern|Date=22 November 2010|Text=This is turning into an annual issue at my firm - our scanners break. I check the search function but didn't see any recent posts, and this is an evolving technology, so...

[[File:http://ak.buy.com/PI/0/500/10355605.jpg]]
We've tried the Xerox Documate 500 series which is great, but slow and aging.

[[File:http://www.elt-pro.ru/catalog/images/L1940A.jpg]]
We tried the HP Scanjet 7650 which work OK but aren't full duplex - it takes three times as long to scan a double sided document.

[[File:http://www.vbology.com/FJPPages/images/HPSJ8250.jpg]]
We tried the HP Scanjet 8200 series which I got used for $80 on eBay - worked great but broke after a few months (no big deal - it was so inexpensive.)

[[File:http://www.imageaccesscorp.com/scanners/images/DocuMate%20152_big.gif]]
We just bought a new Xerox Documate 152 which is great, but doesn't seem to be compatible with our Creative Solutions Engagement software.

What is everyone else using for a scanner? I still think the best solution is a Kyocera high speed copier/scanner, but we're split between two floors and the boss thinks we should each have a scanner at our desk. We're looking into the Fujitsu 6130. Does anyone have any experience with that unit?

I'm curious to know what everyone else is using and what their experience has been with that unit. Most importantly: Would you recommend we buy 5 of them?

Thanks!

Chris}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=22 November 2010|Text=We use Fujitsui scanners will no maintenance problems. They are expensive. Have small profile for desk use. Very fast. Are Twain compliant.}}

Discussion:Cooperation with successor accountant

2010-11-22T23:11:30Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Cooperation with successor accountant

2010-11-22T23:10:30Z

DZCPA:

Discussion Archives:Tax Audit Red Flags

2010-11-21T01:11:42Z

DZCPA:

{{Advanced Tax Questions}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Scott123|Date=20 November 2010|Text=I have a new self employed client, who, because of bankruptcy proceedings, is finally getting around to filing 2006-2009. Late in 2009, he had a flood that trashed most of his paperwork, so he has very little documentation backing everything up. He does have a pretty good memory of his expenses during this time and was able to get new copies of his 1099s. Together, we've been able to reconstruct enough of the lost records to file the returns. The bottom line, though, is that other than still owning most of the assets he's acquired over these years, he's got no paperwork to back everything up, so if he gets audited, he's toast.

For 2006-2008, he only earned a couple thousand dollars a year, but in 2009, he earned $10K. His expenses have gone from $3K to $5K. 2006 has a sizable NOL, but, because of the SOL, I can't carry it forward to use in 2009. Because he's earned so little pre-09 income and his paperwork is so sketchy, I'm tempted to recommend trimming the expenses down to the bare minimum. For 2009, though, he's got to go with the full $5K expenses or his tax liability will go through the roof.

Long story short, what's going to raise a bigger red flag, really sizable NOLs ($400 income and $3K expenses in 06) or expenses that go from $400 to $5K in 3 years?

Considering this guy's financial situation, I'd really like to do my best to keep him under the radar.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=20 November 2010|Text=Just prepare the returns and stop worrying about audit. The odds of an audit here are less than .000001%. The dollars here are toooooo small. You have no red flags!}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DaveFogel|Date=20 November 2010|Text="''2006 has a sizable NOL, but, because of the SOL, I can't carry it forward to use in 2009.''"

How did you reach this conclusion? See [[Discussion: NOL Carryforward not reflected on prior returns]].}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Scott123|Date=21 November 2010|Text=Dave, I'm new to this, so bear with me, but my understanding is that my client:

1. Missed the deadline to waive the carryback for 2006 because they're filing 2006 now.

2. Missed the deadline to amend 2004 to carryforward the NOL because the three year deadline (4/15/10) has passed.

Am I missing something here?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Scott123|Date=21 November 2010|Text=DZCPA, this is probably a dumb question, but do people below the poverty line rarely get audited? I thought the IRS might be more equal opportunity in this regard.}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Irsfixer|Date=21 November 2010|Text=A better question is why would you prepare a return when one is not required for a poor person?}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=21 November 2010|Text=People below the poverty line rarely get audited. Non filiers do (they start showing zero income before the audit). The higher income taxpayers have a higher chance.}}

Discussion:So long and good riddance, Wes

2010-11-20T22:51:28Z

DZCPA:

{{General Chat}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Death&Taxes|Date=20 November 2010|Text=http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6AI42J20101119}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Natalie|Date=November 20, 2010|Text=Not to be confused with [http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/User:WesR WesR].}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Kevinh5|Date=20 November 2010|Text=Hi whom we haven't heard from in way way way too long Bye}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Tax Writer|Date=20 November 2010|Text=I might be poking the hornet's nest here, but I feel bad for the guy. I've been following this case closely and it's obvious that the IRS is making an example out of someone who basically has no business sense whatsoever.

I read interviews and I just feel like he was swindled by bad advisors. They were scummy tax protestors and basically told him everything he wanted to hear. I don't argue that he owes the tax, the penalties, and even the 75% penalty for fraud, but I don't think he should go to jail for misdemeanor failure to file. He was convicted of of failure to file, and he's going away for 3 years? While people with DUI manslaughter convictions often get probation. I don't think that the punishment fits the crime in this case. }}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=20 November 2010|Text=He knew what he was doing was very wrong. We all know we must file. Even a caveman knows that. He deserves every minute in prison. His fans all feel bad for the guy. He is not on my list of favorite actors.}}

Discussion Archives:Tax Audit Red Flags

2010-11-20T18:09:44Z

DZCPA:

Discussion:Form 8879/8878 Signatures

2010-11-19T23:22:11Z

DZCPA:

{{General Chat}}


{{ForumNewPost|UserID=Miltaxman|Date=18 November 2010|Text=I just got the following email on QuickAlerts:

:''The IRS has approved the use of an electronic signature pad by Electronic Return Originators (EROs) to have taxpayers sign Forms 8879 and 8878.''

:''Taxpayers must be present in the ERO's office where the electronic signature pad is located to sign using the signature pad. The ERO must retain the forms with the taxpayers' signatures and ensure the taxpayers have digital access to the electronically signed forms via the ERO's Web site.''

Will it change your practices at all? What does it mean that we must ensure they have access to the electronically signed forms via our website?

Just curious to get people's thoughts.

}}

{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=DZCPA|Date=19 November 2010|Text=Would not use it. The taxpayers need to see return before approving it. We mail those to them and wait for reply. You would have to print returns at time of tax appointment. Also would not work with our 50% mail-in returns.}}