Discussion:Hot news on S corp Health Insurance (Notice 2008-1)

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{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=JAD|Date=19 December 2007|Text=Jim, I think that's a really good summary and it is very nice of you to share. The one thing in addition that will be important to my S corp clients is to remind them that the deduction is not available in any month where the taxpayer or spouse was eligible for coverage through a subsidized employer sponsored health plan.}} {{ForumReplyPost|UserID=JAD|Date=19 December 2007|Text=Jim, I think that's a really good summary and it is very nice of you to share. The one thing in addition that will be important to my S corp clients is to remind them that the deduction is not available in any month where the taxpayer or spouse was eligible for coverage through a subsidized employer sponsored health plan.}}
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 +{{ForumReplyPost|UserID=Mtmckeecpa|Date=19 December 2007|Text=Jd,
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 +Thanks, good information.}}

Revision as of 01:26, 19 December 2007

Discussion Forum Index --> Basic Tax Questions --> Hot news on S corp Health Insurance (Notice 2008-1)
Discussion Forum Index --> Tax Questions --> Hot news on S corp Health Insurance (Notice 2008-1)

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

December 14, 2007
I decided to start a new thread, the other is getting too long. We start with yesterday's posts:

Murrsg07 said:

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/n-08-01.pdf sec 162 deductibility of 2% shareholder-employee ruling to appear Jan. 14, 2008


PVVCPA said:

14 December 2007

No 105 HRA required. Interesting sentence. "A 2-percent shareholder is not an employee for purposes of Sec 106."


I agree, Paul, no mention made of a required written plan, now, so *poof* to 105Concepts and the like, sorry guys. The difficulty is that it requires addition to the W2, which is a huge pain in the keester, esp. since how am I to even know the correct amounts from some of the clients when I'm jamming the W2's out? Ah, well, at least it's written now.

Death&Taxes (talk|edits) said:

14 December 2007
As I said in Discussion: Hello-CPA's Question, that sound you hear is JR gloating Image:smile.jpg. Take a bow, my friend, for never succumbing to panic.

Now maybe we can blow up that other thread, or if we could somehow edit comment #1 to send people to the IRS new position, we could save a lot of eye strain.

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

December 14, 2007
Done.

Thanks, DT, never even thought about that, but IRS did yield to the law and intent here. It's the right thing. But they're making me do those W2's correctly now, so a victory for them, too!

Death&Taxes (talk|edits) said:

14 December 2007
Gosh, IRS may have put Tim out of a job....we won't have anything to write about except reasonable compensation and lost earnest money.

Pete123 (talk|edits) said:

14 December 2007
I guess it would be stretching things to say that reimbursing the employee is -debit insurance expense, credit shareholder loan.

Smokeytax (talk|edits) said:

14 December 2007
Great news re IRS formally acknowledging that reimbursement for employee paid health insurance applies in the case of S Corp health insurance! Bad news that they seem to be saying that inclusion in W-2 is necessary.

I suppose now this justifies my fee for figuring out the W-2 inclusion and communicating it to the payroll services.

I'm still thinking it might not be too crazy to go the simple route & have the S corp deduct the wages, and in the event of audit, amend the W-2 to include the health insurance. The payroll services around here are especially dense about this adjustment.

PVVCPA (talk|edits) said:

14 December 2007
I think a written plan is still required. The plan needs to identify a "class of employees" to avoid FICA. Sec 3121(a)(2). I don't see how this can be accomplished without a written plan. However, the plan can be a simple half-pager. JR1, please let us know when you have that done.

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

December 14, 2007
LOL! Let me add that to my list of things to do now, Paul. Just got my Christmas cards out this morning finally. Newsletters next....two weeks late. And I just fired 105Concepts...what do you read that seems to suggest needing a written plan? The IRS examples are clear and do not mention a plan. Merely applies to 2%> shareholders, and if either reimbursed or paid by the corp, presumed to be deductible, provided that they're in the W2. What a pain. What's the diff? Geez.

So Pete, thinking out loud, I book insurance expense all year long on the corp books. Now, do I debit officer salary and credit insurance to shift it? Or credit NP-S/H? Hmmmmmm...have to think of this. I know, I know, I should know how to do this, but my W3's have always matched PR reports and P/L's for perfect audit trail. No add-on's. Crud, this affects 941 reporting, too. . .back to school to see how all this should work.

Smokeytax (talk|edits) said:

14 December 2007
Honestly, (as opposed to dishonestly, I think it's very possible that when the IRS notice refers to deducting health insurance on page 1 of form 1040 "providing" they were also included in wages, they might be simply trying to prevent a double deduction, rather than trying to trap folks who are reporting the correct adjusted gross income, but without the income being included in wages and the offsetting deduction further down on page 1 of form 1040.

PVVCPA (talk|edits) said:

14 December 2007
Smokey, I agree with your honest analysis. The Notice just says this in a funny way.

JR1, If the S-Corp is not covering all employees, but only a "class of employees", then I think it would be best to prove that with a written plan identifying what that class is. The IRS may attempt to argue the coverage is arbitrary, thus subject to FICA.

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

December 14, 2007
Oh, I get you now, Paul. Sorry, wasn't thinking of the other employees. Good point.

Waynecpa (talk|edits) said:

18 December 2007
So, JR - are you of the opinion (after going back to school) that the 941 reports should match box 1 of the W-3?

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

December 18, 2007
Yeah, it's gotta, right? So now I have to hold doing all the one man S's until they tell me the health insurance that's buried somewhere...

Smokeytax (talk|edits) said:

18 December 2007
JR1 - I think differently - check out the last page of the 2007 Instructions for Forms W-2 and W-3.

It refers to reconciling forms W-2 lines 2, 3, 5, 7, and 9 of forms W-2 with the year's forms 941. Therefore, essentially only social security and medicare wages and taxes, plus federal income taxes withheld, will have to match between the W-2's and the forms 941.

In fact, in my experience with matching letters from the IRS, this is what they do in terms of matching.

Therefore, I'm thinking that box 1 of the W-3 doesn't have to match with the forms 941. Therefore if the client has filed the four quarterly forms 941 and are having us prepare only the forms W-2, we can go ahead and increase box 1 wages for 2% shareholder health insurance without danger of a matching problem down the road.

Natalie (talk|edits) said:

December 18, 2007
Smokey, I'm not sure that's entirely correct. Box 1 of the W3 is "wages, tips and other compensation." Line 2 of the 941 is "wages, tips and other compensation." In the instructions for the 941, it states that the line 2 amount, wages, include amounts that "would also be included in box 1" of the W2. And we know the totals of box 1 on the W2s must add up to box 1 on the W3. It seems to me these must match, and that the health insurance should be included on both forms.

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

December 18, 2007
Kind of moot since I do them at the same time I guess...

Waynecpa (talk|edits) said:

18 December 2007
I could go either way, I guess. What does the IRS match to the 941s? If no box 1 matching, then it would seem we would be ok with just increasing the W-2 for insurance. However, if line 2 of the 941 says it should include all of box 1 of the W-2s, then we would need to increase both. The Notice doesn't really mention this does it?

Jdugancpa (talk|edits) said:

18 December 2007
I sent this email out to my S corp clients yesterday. Use it if you want:

Treatment of Medical Insurance for S Corporation Shareholders

As we approach year end I thought it worthwhile to review the rules pertaining to deduction of medical insurance “above the line” by S corporation shareholders (i.e., as a deduction on Form 1040, page 1 before adjusted gross income, rather than a Schedule A medical expense deduction). Please review these rules and take appropriate action with your payroll company prior to the end of the year so that you can take best advantage of the rules.

Background:

For the purposes of applying the rules for deducting fringe benefits, S Corporation shareholders owning more than 2% of the stock in an S corporation have been treated like partners in a partnership. Accordingly the deductibility of medical insurance by most S corporation shareholders has followed partnership rules rather than the rules that pertain to C corporations. Those rules treat S corporation shareholders and partners as self-employed individuals for the purposes of fringe benefit rules. Since 2003 self-employed individuals have been able to deduct 100% of the amounts paid for medical insurance as an adjustment to gross income (“above the line”) on page 1 of Form 1040.

In mid-2007 the IRS threw a scare into many tax practitioners by announcing that in order to qualify for the deduction the medical insurance had to be “in a plan” and the medical insurance had to be in the name of the S corporation in order to qualify for this treatment. This caused problems for many S corporation shareholders, especially those S corps whose only employee was the shareholder. In those cases in the State of Washington group medical insurance plans are not available and the medical insurance is issued in the name of the employee rather than the name of the corporation. Consequently, deductibility of medical insurance premiums in such cases was put into question.

Resolution:

Last week the IRS issued Notice 2008-1 providing guidance as to how to alleviate that problem. ( http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/n-08-01.pdf ) In short, medical insurance paid under individual medical insurance plans may be deductible “above the line” if the following conditions are met:

1. The corporation must establish a “plan” for the payment of medical insurance premiums on behalf of the shareholder-employee.

2. The corporation must either pay the premiums for the plan, or reimburse the employee-shareholder for the premiums paid after being provided proof of premium payment to the S corp.

3. Premiums so paid or reimbursed on behalf of the shareholder-employee MUST BE ADDED TO W-2 BOX 1 WAGES. These premiums should be EXCLUDED from Box 3 Social Security Wages and Box 5 Medicare Wages (thus they are exempt from FICA taxes completely).

4. On the 1120S for the S corporation, the corporate tax return will include a deduction for wages/compensation paid which includes the medical insurance paid on behalf of the shareholder employee.

5. On the shareholder-employee’s 1040 an above the line deduction will be taken for the medical insurance paid by the corporation which were added to the W-2. In Notice 2008-1 the IRS states that if this treatment is not followed, the medical insurance deduction “above the line” will be disallowed and the deduction will be moved to Schedule A. If this happens, the value of the deduction is generally severely limited due to the 7.5% threshold that must be exceeded before medical expenses are allowed.

ACTION ITEMS YOU MUST TAKE TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THIS DEDUCTION:

1. Document the existence of your corporation’s “plan” by making note of it in your annual minutes.

2. If you have paid the medical insurance individually, gather up all of your medical insurance payments for 2007 and submit a reimbursement to your corporation to reimburse yourself for those amounts. Post the reimbursement check to “Officer Wages” or similar gross pay expense account.

3. Contact your payroll company to provide them with the information necessary to include the medical insurance expense (directly paid by the corporation or reimbursed to the shareholder) in your final paycheck and your W-2 for 2007.

Please call me if you have any questions regarding this memo.

JAD (talk|edits) said:

19 December 2007
Jim, I think that's a really good summary and it is very nice of you to share. The one thing in addition that will be important to my S corp clients is to remind them that the deduction is not available in any month where the taxpayer or spouse was eligible for coverage through a subsidized employer sponsored health plan.

Mtmckeecpa (talk|edits) said:

19 December 2007
Jd,

Thanks, good information.