Discussion:Paying client's interest for my mistake

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Discussion Forum Index --> Basic Tax Questions --> Paying client's interest for my mistake
Discussion Forum Index --> Tax Questions --> Paying client's interest for my mistake

NY428 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
After 10 years as a tax preparer - I have a client who just received an audit notice from NY state that she owes due to a mistake on her 2004 return - sure enough - it was my fault (simple, stupid mistake). She owes $300 in interest, plus the tax. How have others handled paying for this? As a reimbursement to her personally? pay directly to the government? credit against her bills with me? (although I feel she should get free tax preparation on top of paying her interest) Suggestions would be great! (and yes, I know I am calling for e & o insurance as soon as I post this.)

Kevinh5 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
Some feel that the taxpayer had the benefit of the use of the money, so the interest expense belongs to them.

I take the position that I am responsible for my own mistakes, and I would pay the interest by writing a check to the state for the amount in the notice. She is reponsible for the tax, but I don't want the interest to grow because she takes a while to pay the state. I limit my exposure by writing a check now.

Kevinh5 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
I would also go one further and do her return for free this coming year as an apology.

Pegoo (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
I agree with kevin

Kevinh5 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
It is a small price to pay for the goodwill it can build - you 'fessed up to your mistake and made it right. If she leaves you, she is probably not the type of client you want anyway. We are all human and have made errors. For some reason a Bible verse seems appropriate here.

NY428 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
thank you for the advice - I think I will write a check directly to the state-

Belle (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
A sidebar question to this issue - Is the interest I pay for a client deductible by me as "an ordinary & necessary business expense? What about a penalty I pay for a client? ('Cuz I'm NOT perfect & do make mistakes).

Kevinh5 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
Yes, Belle, it is ordinary & necessary.

PHIL MOODY (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
If you pay it directly to the state, are you not paying someone else's interest, thus it is income to your client??

If you make the check payable to the client. it may be considered an adjustment for fees charged?

Kevinh5 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
when you get your oil changed and they forget to put the plug back in and you drive off and your engine blows up and the oil change dealer buys you a new engine

should the oil change dealer give you a 1099 for the new engine?

TheTinCook (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
HRB sends a 1099 when we pay interest and penelties.

Death&Taxes (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
TC: as a 1099-INT or 1099-MISC Block 3?

TheTinCook (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
Misc.

EZTAX (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
Agree with those above who suggested paying both interest and penalty in addition to a freeebie next season. Why loose a client over this? Also, as Kevinh5 points out, the goodwill earned is more than worth the cost and the word does get out, either positive or negative, depending on how you handle it.

This is one of the hard parts of the job, admitting mistakes and handling them honarably. I feel that handling the situation well can get you a client for the long term and really defines what type of business you run.

Rgtaxservice (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
I've had two occasions when I paid the penalty/interest to my clients for errors that were truly my fault. Like reporting 27K instead of 29K...transposed the numbers.

However, on one occasion I did pay the tax. I had the niece of an 80+ yr old man stop by one April 12th to have me prepare the PA State Property Tax Rebate form. This form was not due until June 30th and after a long tax season, I tucked the form away to review after the 15th. Needless to say, it got tucked into a folder never to be seen again....until the niece called in July. Seems I forgot all about the uncle's form. The tax Rebate deadline was set in stone...so I couldn't just file it late. He was out of the rebate money. I felt so bad I wrote the uncle the $500 check for the rebate he would have recieved if I had done my job.

Now no good deed goes unpunished. The niece and her husband were so impressed with the way I conducted myself in making things right for their uncle, then came to me as clients the following season. They came bearing a plumbing business and 5 rental buildings :) It was like hitting the jackpot.Image:bigsmile.jpg

Fuzzy Faced Leader (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
I guess I am the odd ball who disagrees with the rest of the posters. The interest charges is not a penalty for filing an erroneous tax return. It is money that the client earned by not paying enough tax. The client reviewed and signed the return. Who's to say he didn't notice the error, and sent it in anyway. Since the client earned the interest, he should remit it to the taxing authority. I pay penalties, but not interest.

Regarding the motor replacement, the new motor is not income. It is a replacement of a damaged asset. The dealer will not replace it with a new engine, but a comparable used engine. I know, this exact thing happened to me.

Death&Taxes (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
I've seen that argument, but as one suffering client noted when hearing that they made interest, 'yes, but you made me take a loan I did not want.'

Kevinh5 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
Fuzzy - I'm SO GLAD to be able to talk with someone with the exact same situation.

The question really is, 'is the customer with the used engine better off than he was before going to the oil-change dealer?'


You could argue either way.

Natalie (talk|edits) said:

December 20, 2007
If I were the client, I would appreciate the preparer paying it. Yes, I might have earned interest on it. But the interest rates are generally higher when borrowing than when earning on a savings account. And if you want to get really picky, most likely tax is paid on the interest income while interest expense is not deductible.

HAPPY TAX (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
I always pay the interest and any penalties that resulted from my oversight, plus I always refund the fee for the return that I misprepared. I don't overthink it because I'm afraid I'll just end up finding excuses and explanations for why my mistake was really someone else's fault. If I mess up, I just pay the piper. This creates a really big incentive for me to pay attention and get it right the first time.

Riley2 (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
Amounts paid to or on behalf of a client to make him whole are not included income. In other words, if the payment merely brings the client back to the same position that he would have been in had the mistake not been made, then there is no economic gain, and thus, no income. See Rev. Rul. 57-47.

However, under RR 57-47, reimbursement for interest charges would constitute taxable income to the client since he had the use of the funds. Similarly, preparation of the client’s tax return without charge would constitute taxable income to the client.

Death&Taxes (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
Damned experts have to make us feel bad for doing right!!!!!!! Image:smile.jpg

Anne (talk|edits) said:

20 December 2007
Hi Everyone,

I also pay the interest & penalties if it's my fault. I would also prepare the next year for free or at a discount.

Riley2 (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
Would you pay the extra taxes that a client might have to pay as a result of a missed election?

CrowJD (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
Even if you have E&O insurance, I don't think I'd file a claim over an amt. of $300.

Mtmckeecpa (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
That is why I carry E&O insurance...

As a side note, I picked up a new client in May and we filed their S corp and 1040 by the extended deadlines (or so I thought extended deadline on the 1040). Turns out the other CPA firm DID NOT timely file his 4868...client gets a $22k late filing penalty assessemntunderline text..

At what point do you call your E&O carrier?

DZCPA (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
Pay the interest. Charge for the next year's tax return. I would not do it for free. You will not lose a client if you pay for your stupid mistakes.

Dennis (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
I don't think Revenue Ruling 57-47 is quite on point here. Preparer in this case caused client to overpay tax (payment of difference between correct tax and overpayment not income) and paid her 6 percent interest on the money she was out (logically taxable income) and refunded the fee which she had previously deducted (also logically taxable income.)

CrowJD (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
Mtm: if you are asking the question when? Read the policy carefully, especially anything termed: duty to cooperate, notify etc. I'd err on the safe side; the making of a notification would not the same as actually submitting a claim.

Natalie (talk|edits) said:

December 21, 2007
Crow very good point. If there's even a hint that a claim might be filed, one would need to notify the carrier. If notification is not made and there is a claim, the insurance company is not bound to cover it.

Death&Taxes (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
btw: the Foreclosure Bill that exempts that income is partly paid for by assessing penalties on late filed S Corps....something we never had to contend with before.

94nole (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
Show me a person who's never made a $300 mistake...

Pay the interest BUT a free return for next year? Depends. Depends on the client and your relationship with them. I would very likely charge for the return work going forward but give them above and beyond service. Your service and time is valuable. We are humans first and professionals second and we all make mistakes.

Thank goodness all of our mistakes are not audited.

Donniecastleman (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
I have E&O Insurance for my Notary Public functions, but after reading all of this, should I also the the same for my Tax Work? I think the answer is a resounding yes, but do I just go back to the same place I got E&O the first time? Thanks for chiming in.

Jmolliconi (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
Great discussion. I made a mistake in 2005 on a client I've had for 20 years. I just didn't include their IRA distributions and they're an age for the mandatory distributions. So they had to pay the taxes and I paid the interest and penalty that I calculated. I found the error when reviewing 2006 with them. Apparently I'd over-calculated because they got $11+ back from the IRS and the wife sent me the letter and an $11 check for it. I hadn't thought of doing this year's return gratis, but it wouldn't hurt, would it? Our good fortune when nothing big happens, isn't it, with a one person office and only ourselves to review things when it's busy.

HAPPY TAX (talk|edits) said:

21 December 2007
I take a slightly different tack in that I refund the fee for the return I goofed up. Otherwise, they paid for something they didn't get, i.e., a professionally-prepared, error-free return. That way I don't have to worry about doing next year's return for free, plus the client is perfectly free to have his next return done elsewhere. As I posted earlier, this is just my policy, and I don't allow myself to overthink it. If I start picking the particulars apart, I'm afraid I'll find myself looking for, and undoubtedly finding, reasons that my mistake had to have been someone else's fault. Plus this really, really keeps me focused. I don't have to do this often, and I've never lost a client due to my error, but that's not really why I do it this way. I just figure that it's so rare anymore for a business to really stand behind its work. All companies say they will, but when it comes right down to brass tacks, how many are really willing to write that check?

Natalie (talk|edits) said:

December 21, 2007
Donnie, E&O is a must in my book.

Happy Tax, do you say you will provide error-free returns? And do you think that's really what clients expect - especially given the annual articles about 50 tax preparers producing 50 different responses to one set of facts?

Fuzzy Faced Leader (talk|edits) said:

22 December 2007
Kevin, if the replaced engine has less miles than the old engine, then the client benefits. In my case the dealer replaced an engine with 150,000 miles with an engine with 100,000 miles, so I was better off.

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