Discussion:Holding tax return until paid for services
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Discussion Forum Index --> Tax Questions --> Holding tax return until paid for services
| 6 December 2007 | |
| Hello All,
We prepared a client's S-Corp and amended 1040 for 2006. The client came by when I was not in my office (I really hate it when clients just show up!) to sign and pick his returns. He needed copied to send to his bank for a loan. My assistant gave him the returns, but I probably would have held then until I got paid. I had a retainer but there was a large amount still due. (That will teach me to get a larger retainer in the future!) I have not sent in his returns yet. My question is this: Can I legally wait to send in his returns until I get paid? I know that P&I will continue to accrue, but I don't want to be responsible for any P&I. Will I be okay if I send him an e-mail which explains my policy (my engagement letter states that payment is due upon presentation of invoice.) and inform him that P&I will accrue until payment full payment is made? | |
Southparkcpa (talk|edits) said: | 6 December 2007 |
| Cindylee
If you are a CPA you can get yourself in HOT water here if the client files a complaint against you. In NC where I live, CPA's are scrutinized over customer complaints. A CPA may NOT hold client records for non payment. The mistake here was allowing your assitant to feel free to release the return. You may , and on rare occasions I do this, hold the retun for payment or credit card. I believe that is your question. You may NOT withhold their information but you can hold the 1040 waiting for the payment . Call the client, ask for an additional payment etc... and most people will pay. This is the reason I accept credit cards. Holding the returns can be seen as unprofessional.
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| 6 December 2007 | |
| Southpark is correct, as a CPA, you cannot withhold client records for non payment, but the completed tax return is not really the clients records. It's funny, we have a lot of clients come in, pick up their returns, sign the EF authorization and then not pay. We have a policy that we don't efile until we have the signed authorizations and payment.
One young couple did this back in late Feb and then calls back in april saying they hadn't received their $3,500 + refund. I checked the system and then let them know that it wasn't efiled yet becuase they hadn't paid. They weren't happy, but they knew the policy and while they weren't happy, they came in paid and then they were efiled. | |
| 6 December 2007 | |
| We need to work like HR BLOCK guys. Once client comes to pick stuff up, start asking for a credit card or check. =) For personal returns, the HR BLOCK accountant walks you to the register and he/she hands over the cashier ur files and thanks you =) | |
| 6 December 2007 | |
| Bold textI disagree! You are correct when you say that you cannot withhold the client's records. However, the return is NOT YET his record until he pays for it! Return all the other documents which are indeed his! | |
| 6 December 2007 | |
| Not positive on this, but I think we can't ethically hold the return. I used to work at one of the Big 8. There was one client who would never pay his huge bill until very late. We changed how we did the work for him. We would get the return to where it was almost complete, send the client a bill, then tell him that we weren't doing any more work on this return until he paid it. | |
| 6 December 2007 | |
| We do not have to give them the work we have done, but we do have to give them the records they provided back. | |
| 6 December 2007 | |
| A new client came into my CPA practice and asked if I was accepting
new clients. He was unhappy with his new CPA, who had all his records, because she had not completed his tax return and now the due date had past for filing the return. He claimed that she had the records for over a month. I told him to go to the CPA and tell her if she was not able to complete the return in the next week he wanted his documents returned. Two weeks later he walks into my office with his documents. The penalities totaled over $2,000. He filed a complaint with the state board of accountancy. The CPA hired an attorney to respond to the state board. The state board ruled that there was not enough information to determine if the CPA was at fault. She claimed the client had not provided all the information she needed to complete the return. According to the client, he says he was told by the board to sue the CPA and if a judgement was rendered in his favor, the board would reopen his complaint.He decided not to sue.You never know who or what will rise up and bite you. I wonder if she had insurance. | |
TheTinCook (talk|edits) said: | 7 December 2007 |
| Lol Pegoo. It's the only way to work. The only downside is when you have a couple of files aging in your inventory for a few weeks awaiting payment. Now if they only get rid of the "If you're not satisfied, you don't have to pay" policy.
As others have said, we can ethically hold the return hostage as long as we give back the client's original documents. However, we can't extort the client (i.e. waiting till one day before the deadline and demanding an additional $1000). | |
| 7 December 2007 | |
| When i lived in Iowa our firm policy was to get paid and then you get the completed tax returns or financial statements. clients new this, often tried to get out the door without paying but once the receptionist was told to not give the returns to them until she received payment we were fine. I do not see anything wrong with witholding your work product until payment is made as long as you made this clear from the outset via verbal discussion or a written engagement letter. | |
| 7 December 2007 | |
| I dont know any reason one my clients would leave without payment. I have had this policy for over 20 years and I also dont accept credit or debit cards, give me cash or check. When clients ask me when I a going to take cr. cards I say never. No problem.. | |
| 7 December 2007 | |
| The way I figure it, a client can only burn you once. I can count on one hand the clients that got upset and didn't pay full price for return. If they whine about bill, I tell them to just pay me what they think it is worth and then I say good riddens to them. If they are back next year, they must pre-pay and they must make up the difference from prior year as well.
My after the fact method to collect payment for returns filed is to send client letter indicating that I am writing to taxing authorities and requesting my name be removed as paid preparer. this usually works quite well too. | |
| 7 December 2007 | |
| Fstein says "Send client letter indicating that I'm writing to tax authorities and requesting my name be removed as paid preparer".
While this is what I've heard other practitioners do, and I HAVE DONE IT MYSELF IN THE PAST, I'm just wondering - what do you do when the client DOES FINALLY pay you? Do you write again to IRS to reclaim being a paid preparer? For that reason, I have discontinued taking that approach. | |
Death&Taxes (talk|edits) said: | 7 December 2007 |
| I agree with Uncle Sam but for different reasoning: to me it would put me on the same petty level as the client who does not pay. I would be denying the quality work I did by sending IRS a letter and a copy to him. | |
Tonymontana (talk|edits) said: | 7 December 2007 |
| I just look at it as a cost of getting rid of a PITA if it's under $500. I never let it get beyond that if I think it's a shakey client. For the most part I'll just send out collection letters. Believe it or not 9 out of 10 times I'll get paid with just a collection letter. I've even been surprised on some that I wrote off as uncollectable when I get a check in the mail after sending out a non-threating letter.
There was one this year that took over a year to pay me. I just told them that I couldn't help them until I received payments for past and current dues. They understood and paid me up front for current year dues. This same person called me last week and wanted to know if she could start paying me for next years dues. I said, "sure, and if you send your payment before 12/31/07. I'll charge you 2007 fees since my fees are going up in 2008." FYI: This is a very small problem in my practice, but it does happen occasionally. | |
| 7 December 2007 | |
| I have actually never sent a letter to the IRS. And I do agree that unless it were over $500, I would just write it off.
In the case that the letter does get sent, well, that means the client is no longer a client and so be it. I agree with tony Montana, although in his case, I think the fact that people pay him is because they do not want to "say hello to his little friend". Those that don't pay, in the end good riddance. | |
| 7 December 2007 | |
| Thanks for the input! It is always interesting to hear how other professionals handle the situation. | |
| 7 December 2007 | |
| Found some good advice here too Cindy and it got me paid this year...1099C cancellation of debt reported to IRS as income to the deadbeat. It has given me some leverage in collecting debts and I have actually gotten paid about 3600.00 in November alone by threatening them with it.....good luck to you!! | |
| 7 December 2007 | |
| How about, returning documents, keeping the actual tax return, and still filing small claims for non payment for services rendered? | |
| 8 December 2007 | |
| Nothing personal, but...must we go through this topic again and again and again? Please people, it's been posted so many times all you have to do is read what is already here.
There is a search function just for this purpose. | |
| 17 December 2007 | |
| Skassela, I would like to know what word you used to search regarding this topic?
I DID use the search and didn't find much. I think it really depends on the words that we use and NOT everyone will use the same thing. My feeling is that if you are tired of reading about a topic then don't bother to read and reply. | |
| 18 December 2007 | |
| http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:Retaining_Clients_records
http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:If_client_does_not_pay_for_work_performed http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:Do_I_have_to_give_to_client_my_quickbooks_files%3F http://www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:Holding_client_documents
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