Discussion:Contribution to church w/o 501(c)(3) status

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Discussion Forum Index --> Basic Tax Questions --> Contribution to church w/o 501(c)(3) status
Discussion Forum Index --> Tax Questions --> Contribution to church w/o 501(c)(3) status

IRS4LIFE (talk\|edits) said:	18 March 2009
Can you please point me to the code, regulations, or an IRS publication where contributions to a church/organization without 501(c)(3) tax-exempt status is addressed? I read www.taxalmanac.org/index.php/Discussion:Deductible_contribution but there's no citations there. Thanks in advance.

BeachCPA (talk\|edits) said:	18 March 2009
A "church" is not defined in the IRS. If it otherwise qualifies for 501(c)(3) status despite not having it, a charitable contribution to it will be deductible. See Pub 1828.

CPAdavid (talk|edits) said:

18 March 2009

IRS4LIFE,

Whether or not contributions to an organization are tax-deductible depends on whether they qualify under section 170 (b) to receive charitable contributions. A church does qualify under section 170(b)(1)(A)(i).

Please refer to IRC Section 508(a), which provides the requirement that 501(c)(3) organizations must apply to the IRS for recognition of exempt status ("give notice to the Secretary") in order to qualify to receive deductible contributions. Sec 508(c)(1)(A) then provides for a "mandatory" exception for churches.

Churches of any level of gross receipts are not required to apply to the IRS for recognition of exempt status. This does not in any way affect the deductibility of contributions on the donors' tax return.

If you are an IRS employee, surely you have access to people in EO division that could educate you on this issue. What is the state of the IRS when its employees find preference in consulting Taxalmanac rather than use their own resources? No personal offense intended. I know we are a friendly and generous crew here on TA;-) I'd much rather ask a question here than phone the IRS.

IDrinkYour Milkshake (talk\|edits) said:	18 March 2009
Ha! The IRS asking US for audit guidance! In that case, I recommend any income earned by working is tax free!

Blrgcpa (talk\|edits) said:	18 March 2009
The IRS publishes a book of tax exempt organizations.

RoyDaleOne (talk\|edits) said:	18 March 2009
Donations to real a Church that has not, and is not required to file, for an official determination by the IRS of the church exempt status, are still deductible. In addition, these entities would not be listed in the compilation of exempt organization by the IRS.

RoyDaleOne (talk\|edits) said:	18 March 2009
Wow, I did not notice that the IRS is acknowledging that they are monitoring this web site. I always assumed that the IRS would review the posts on this site.

JR1 (talk\|edits) said:	March 18, 2009
OH! I just read that profile. That gives me chills....

IRS4LIFE (talk\|edits) said:	19 March 2009
Sorry to disturb any delusions of grandeur, but I'm here in an individual capacity. Just seeing what the CPAs/EAs think. 'Tis all. Thanks for the citations.

Natalie (talk\|edits) said:	March 19, 2009
I thought it was a test. I'd give David an "A" as usual.

JR1 (talk\|edits) said:	March 19, 2009
IRS, don't misunderstand, it's good to have you here. The more communication between the Service and the pro community, the better! We are working for the same end, to legally administer the system that Congress creates! Stick around. It'll keep us on our toes. And best behavior.

IRS4LIFE (talk\|edits) said:	20 April 2009
Thanks, everyone!

CrowJD (talk|edits) said:

20 April 2009

The idea of the tax exemption for the church is that they are supposed to turn around and help the poor. And I mean more than 9 cents on the dollar! These fat cats today are tripping over each other for a piece of fried chicken or church lady food, and the poor can take a hike.

Even Jesus knew enough to give the poor sinners a fish dinner before he started preaching. You won't see that kind of common sense today.

EasternPA (talk|edits) said:

21 April 2009

I prepared a few deductions for cash contributions of extremely large cash donations. For example, a hubby and wife and kids that make around $40,000 donated $7,000 to their church. They had a nice letter from the church - signed by somebody. It just seemed tooooo improbable, but possible enough that I could not deny it. I did transcribe the letter in the preparer notes in case the IRS doubts my sanity or gullibility.

Now a days, any one with a 'puter and printer can make a credible looking church letter.

I think it would help if churches had EIN numbers, so it can be included with the deduction. At least the IRS could quickly check to see if a church is handing out a million dollars of contribution chits.

Mscash (talk\|edits) said:	21 April 2009
The church would have to have its individual exemption "Yourtown Christian Fellowship (Nondenominational)" or be covered by a blanket exemption "Yourtown United Methodist Church" or its a non starter. You can't just wrap yourself in the Bible or other scripture and be a tax exempt organization.

TTMM (talk|edits) said:

21 April 2009

Unfortunately Mscash you don't need to wrap yourself in the Bible to be a church. The IRS doesn't want to say something isn't religion just because its unorthodox. They have a checklist of sorts to determine if it is a legit church. If they people have regular meetings, regular meeting places and such then they can be a church. Obviously if you worship trees you might want to get a determination letter. But the Bible isn't necessarily a prerequisite.

There is a big difference between a tax exempt organization and a church. CPAdavid has it spot on.

CrowJD (talk|edits) said:

22 April 2009

I went to preacher school at a time when you had to be ready for anything. We was all expected to be a Jack of All Trades. I say Jack, because at the time, Jill was not preaching.

So I got certified in all of them. Including Suffism.

In fact, they went as far as to train us to pick the next Dali Llama if we was called upon to do it.

I still got the little box they glued to the front of my head when I spent my six months as a Hasidic Jew (we was temporarily adopted by a Hasidic grandmother).

So, there's some truth to what TIMM is saying. Though some of these new wavers I'd have to study up on to get up to grade.

May I pass on a story told of the Baal Shem Tov? We are reminded that when one has departed from God, the love of man is his only salvation. To illustrate this, a father complained to the Baal-Shem, "My son is estranged from God...what shall I do?" The Baal-Shem replied, "Love him more, love him more." There's a lot of truth to that. The old rascal knew what he was a doin'.

Riley2 (talk\|edits) said:	23 April 2009
IRS4Life, there is nothing in Sec. 508 that says that a charitable organization without a 501(c)(3) determination letter cannot accept tax deductible contributions under Sec. 170.