Discussion:Club dues: personal trainer
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Discussion Forum Index --> Advanced Tax Questions --> Club dues: personal trainer
Discussion Forum Index --> Tax Questions --> Club dues: personal trainer
| 28 March 2008 | |
| Is there any known exception to the non-deductibility of health club dues? I have a personal trainer client who generally spends the majority of his time either marketing for new clients or training existing clients in the club. | |
| 28 March 2008 | |
| These people must come in late. There's one about the golf pro below. See Country Club Meeting Place. | |
RoyDaleOne (talk|edits) said: | 28 March 2008 |
| If the client is a real personal trainer, and if the health club dues was necessary to conduct his business, and if he coducted the business in the health club and if there was no personal use I think a case could be made for deducting the health club dues as a business expense. | |
Seaside CPA (talk|edits) said: | 28 March 2008 |
| I agree with Roy. If client uses the club only for the use of training his clients, it would appear to be an ordinary and necessary business expense. | |
RoyDaleOne (talk|edits) said: | 28 March 2008 |
| From an IRS Paper:
"c. Possible Allowance of Deduction -- Fitness expenses might be deductible in certain situations, where there is a concrete connection with the taxpayer's trade or business." | |
| 28 March 2008 | |
| No arguement with whether it's ordinary and necessary. I have trouble getting past SEc 274(a)(3). "no deduction shall be allowed under this chapter for amounts paid or incurred for membership in any club organized for business, pleasure, recreation, or other social purpose, | |
| 28 March 2008 | |
| You don't have to get past that section since it does'nt apply. | |
RoyDaleOne (talk|edits) said: | 28 March 2008 |
| Well, look at 274(e)..exceptions..
(8) ENTERTAINMENT SOLD TO CUSTOMERS Expenses for goods or services (including the use of facilities)
which are sold by the taxpayer in a bona fide transaction for an
adequate and full consideration in money or money's worth.
Maybe this would apply, I don't know. | |
RoyDaleOne (talk|edits) said: | 28 March 2008 |
| Are you such you are dealing with a club? | |
| 28 March 2008 | |
| I don't think 247 would apply. Is there a concrete connection to the business of the TP, as stated above by RDO. Now, to the extent the TP did personal work-outs (non-teaching, personal workouts), that percentage would have to come off. | |
| 28 March 2008 | |
| How can you deprive the TP of an ordinary and necessary business expense directly connected with his business? He's not meeting for an entertainment purpose. However, he does not get 100% of the deduction if he's doing personal workouts there also. I would not take the deduction unless he had records of his personal use vs, business use, because he will workout there too, you know he will. | |
RoyDaleOne (talk|edits) said: | 29 March 2008 |
| I wonder if this "club" is a club, or, is it a business?
Working out with your client (at the same time) in my way of thinking is not "personal" use. | |
| 29 March 2008 | |
| I agree, if working out at the same time, it would not be personal use. What they mean above by club orgainzied for business would be, in my opinion, certain lucheon and dinner clubs where you can take a client for lunch etc. These are not in a country club setting, but actaully a part of an office building. Sort of exclusive, meet and rub elbows type thing. | |
| 1 April 2008 | |
| I wish that was the case. 274(a)(3) says no deduction for dues paid to a club organized for business, pleasure, recreation, or other social purpose if one of the clubs principle purposes is either to conduct entertainment activities for members or guests, or to provide members or their guests with access to entertainment facilites. With respect to this health club, there is now doubt it provides these things. | |
RoyDaleOne (talk|edits) said: | 1 April 2008 |
| There is an exception, for certain expenses that the normal taxpayer can not deduct, such as entertainment, if you are in the business of entertaining. A band in a nightclub is an example.
Is not the personal trainer in the business of providing entertainment, since health club facilities are considered entertainment facilities, and are not his customers considered being entertained? | |
| 2008-04-01 | |
| Health Clubs provide FREE membership to their staff, including their own personal trainers. If TP free lances or owns his own biz, and contracts with clubs, then that's a different story. | |
| 2 April 2008 | |
| TP is free lance personal trainer, and pays dues and various clubs where he meets and takes clients. Interesting comment by Roy regarding exception. It would certainly work if he was employed by the facility (hence no dues, but wages to club). Not sure otherwise. | |
| 2 April 2008 | |
| Well, maybe the personal trainers association should lobby Congress to clarify the law. It just happens sometimes that when they draft these things, they don't think of all the angles. RDO's comments are right on the mark as far as I'm concerned. Your client is there to earn a living, to the extent his uses it as entertainment, he can't take that percentage. You wanna 8275 it, and is this guy prepared to make his argument at higher levels... go for it. P.S. the freelance golf pros can start lobbying the Congress people on the course too! | |
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