Discussion:Brother-Sister Controlled Group - 50% Test or 80% Test

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Discussion Forum Index --> Tax Questions --> Brother-Sister Controlled Group - 50% Test or 80% Test

PVVCPA (talk|edits) said:

June 28, 2007
Sorry for another Controlled Group test. I can't seem to get off this controlled group thing.

My PPC 1120 Deskbooks statest that American Jobs Creation Act of 2004 changed the definition of a Brother-Sister Controlled Group for purposes of applying Sec 1561 (which includes the allocation of the 15% & 25% tax brackets). PPC states that the 80% rule is no longer applicable when determining whether or not corporations will be considered a brother - sister controlled group.

It appears that I missed this change in the law.

If only the 50% rule applies, then me and all of you may have a lot more brother - sister controlled groups than we think.

Has anyone reviewed this and can confirm that this change was made?

PPC cites IRC 1563(f)(5). But I need the help of an EA on this, because I cannot read code.

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

June 28, 2007
LOL! How about an EA in training? Just read about this yesterday, and since I don't have C corps much, didn't care to remember, but checking...here ya go. Bro-sister owned by five or less of the same people and both must be true: 1. These five own 80% or more of voting stock or 80% or more of all classes of stock of each corp, AND 2. These five or fewer own more than 50% of voting stock or more than 50% of all classes of stock to the extent of identical ownership. A note says: For tax years beg. after 10/22/04, the 80% ownership test of B-S controlled group no longer applies for the purposes of the TI brackets, AMT exemptions, and AE credit. The 80% test does continue for other Code provisions.

Now, what does all that mean?

PVVCPA (talk|edits) said:

June 28, 2007
JR, What research source are you citing from? I was kinda hoping PPC misinterpreted the Code, but that hope is quickly diminishing if your source says the same thing.

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

June 28, 2007
This must be a distillation of the Regs, and has no references. It's for the purpose of passing the EA exam and is just the law without commentary. And not overly detailed...It's a near 1000 page reference manual from NATP.

PVVCPA (talk|edits) said:

June 28, 2007
Oh, the NATP. They don't know anything! Right Kevin?  :)

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

June 28, 2007
Figured you'd say that....

KatieJ (talk|edits) said:

28 June 2007
PVV, why can't you read Code? It's right here on Tax Almanac for anyone to read, and it is written in English, believe it or not <G>. Well, sort of.

IRC Sec. 1563(a)(2) defines a brother-sister controlled group as one where 5 or fewer individuals, estates or trusts own more than 50 percent of the voting power. The 80% test went away with the 1969 tax reform act.

IRC Sec. 1563(f)(5) was added by the American Jobs Creation Act of 2004. It changes the definition of a bro-sis controlled group as described by JR. But this definition is for purposes of Code provisions "other than this part." Sec. 1561-63 constitutes Part II of Subchapter B of Chapter 6 of Subtitle A of the Code. So by my reading, (f)(5) does not apply to the allocation of the tax brackets, which is governed by Sec. 1561, which is in Part II, i.e., "this part." Therefore, the ownership requirement for a bro-sis group for purposes of Sec. 1561 is the 50% rule of Sec. 1563(a)(2), and this has been true since 1970.

Temporary Reg. Sec. 1.1563-1T(a)(3)lays out these rules in detail and gives examples.

This points up the danger of relying on tax information (textbooks, training materials, editorial explanations, form instructions, IRS publications, etc.) and not checking tax authority (Code, regs, rulings, case law) to confirm it. Information is useful, but you cannot rely on it.

In the fall of 2005 I taught the graduate tax research course at San Diego State University while the regular professor was on sabbatical. It was an educational experience for me as well as for the students, although I had been preaching to my SDSU state & local tax students and tax staff for years about the difference between information and authority. One of the students in the research class was a local practitioner who had been in the business for 25 years and never looked at anything beyond IRS publications and form instructions. At the end of the semester he thanked me and said, "I used to just look this stuff up in the IRS pubs. Now I write a memo citing authority and send the client a bill!"

I tried to create links to the code and regs, but it didn't work. Perhaps someone can do that for us.

JR1 (talk|edits) said:

June 28, 2007
Actually, just learned yesterday that even the Rev Rulings and Procs are NOT authoritative. They are binding on IRS...Only the Code, Regs, and Case Law are truly authoritative.

KatieJ (talk|edits) said:

28 June 2007
That's why we spend quite a bit of time in the research course on the relative weight of authority. All authority is not created equal. Generally, the U.S. Constitution trumps statutory law; statutory law and tax treaties trump regulations (except in the case of legislative regs, which are specifically authorized by the statute (e.g., the IRC Sec. 1502 regs)); and statutory law and regs trump rulings, rev procs, notices, etc. It's the courts that decide these things, and the higher the court, the greater its authority. The federal court system starts with trial courts (District Courts, Federal Court of Claims, Tax Court) and moves through the Circuit Courts of Appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court (which takes very few federal income tax cases). Any time you cite a court case, you need to check to make sure the decision hasn't been overturned or modified by a higher court.

Rev Ruls and Rev Procs are authoritative in the sense that taxpayers can rely on them. However, if they do not comport with the statute, a court (or the IRS itself, later on) may invalidate them. The same is true of administrative (as opposed to legislative) regulations. It's generally easier to overturn a ruling than a regulation, because regs go through an administrative law process (notice of intent, issuance of proposed reg, public comment period, hearings, etc.) while rulings are just administrative interpretations by the IRS.

When talking about "authority," it's also important to consider what constitutes "substantial authority" for purposes of avoiding accuracy-related penalties. Rev Ruls and Rev Procs, and congressional committee reports on legislation, for example, are "authority" for that purpose (see Reg. Sec. 1.6662-4(d)(3)(iii)).

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